Duster in a green gas GBB?

[matt491]

Well, I know using green gas or propane on a gun built for duster is really bad for it and will crack any plastic slide, but are there any negative consequences to using duster on a gun built for propane!? Other than the fact that the blowback will be weaker?

[Styrak]

Like you said, the slide may not cycle (for example if it's a full metal gun) or the mags may not hold gas because there is not enough pressure on the seals because they're used to propane.

[Crunchmeister]

Well, over lunch today, I tried duster gas in my green gas / propane M9, and it didn't work for shit. I gave it a good fill. I fired one shot, which was too weak to even cycle the slide all the way back, and the BB never even made it the length of the 25-foot hallway. It hit the floor about 3-4 feet short of the target. On the second shot, the BB did little more than roll out the barrel, falling a couple of feet in front of me. The mag valve just stayed open and dumped the rest of the duster gas. There wasn't enough pressure on the valve to reclose it after the shot.

So I refilled with propane, and emptied the rest of the 23 rounds in the mag without a problem. So I guess that means it doesn't work very well at all.

[Flying Squirrel]

This has already been covered about a million times. A simple search would have told you that.

The chemical composition of the three gases are different and the PSI of the three varies as well. HFC143A is Similar to Propane, but generally Duster is 20 PSI Less.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by Crunchmeister

Well, over lunch today, I tried duster gas in my green gas / propane M9, and it didn't work for shit. I gave it a good fill. I fired one shot, which was too weak to even cycle the slide all the way back, and the BB never even made it the length of the 25-foot hallway. It hit the floor about 3-4 feet short of the target. On the second shot, the BB did little more than roll out the barrel, falling a couple of feet in front of me. The mag valve just stayed open and dumped the rest of the duster gas. There wasn't enough pressure on the valve to reclose it after the shot.

So I refilled with propane, and emptied the rest of the 23 rounds in the mag without a problem. So I guess that means it doesn't work very well at all.

That's pretty much the sum of it right there.

Back in the day, when Green Gas was like $35/bottle, duster was the cheaper alternative... but now, being able to use cheap propane, duster is the pricier option and I think most people would want to switch to it if they can, not vice versa.

[matt491]

Originally Posted by Flying Squirrel

This has already been covered about a million times. A simple search would have told you that.

The chemical composition of the three gases are different and the PSI of the three varies as well. HFC143A is Similar to Propane, but generally Duster is 20 PSI Less.

I'm aware that the chemical composition is different and that it's weaker, that wasn't what I was asking! What I wanted to know was it if could possible damage the mag or gun somehow, but if it can't even cycle the slide, then I guess the answer is no, it can't.

Originally Posted by Drake

That's pretty much the sum of it right there.

Back in the day, when Green Gas was like $35/bottle, duster was the cheaper alternative... but now, being able to use cheap propane, duster is the pricier option and I think most people would want to switch to it if they can, not vice versa.

I'm just wondering if there's any way out of the crappy smell of propane, that's all. I shoot my gbb's all the time and the propane smell is startin' to get to me.

[Flying Squirrel]

Sorry, didn't mean to sound that way.

If your gun still cycles then there shouldn't be an issue. Just add a drop of silicon oil as you would with propane. I used to switch between all three of them depending on conditions and type of game.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by matt491

I'm just wondering if there's any way out of the crappy smell of propane, that's all. I shoot my gbb's all the time and the propane smell is startin' to get to me.

Not much you can do about that, short of going back to oldschool green gas with the fruity smell, heh.

Propane is heavier than air and will "sink" to floor level; maybe use one of those "air sponge" canisters on the floor, near your shooting area, to try and soak up the propane smell?

[Styrak]

Originally Posted by Flying Squirrel

This has already been covered about a million times. A simple search would have told you that.

The chemical composition of the three gases are different and the PSI of the three varies as well. HFC143A is Similar to Propane, but generally Duster is 20 PSI Less.

HFC134A = Duster
Propane = Green Gas
Period.

[hutch1970]

The propane smell in an out door game could be an advantage. Your enemy begins to suspect your location according to "that" smell. Except "that" smell is coming from a small canister w/ a open-close valve cracked open. Meanwhile your waiting for someone to come along noticing "that" propane smell.

[matt491]

Originally Posted by hutch1970

The propane smell in an out door game could be an advantage. Your enemy begins to suspect your location according to "that" smell. Except "that" smell is coming from a small canister w/ a open-close valve cracked open. Meanwhile your waiting for someone to come along noticing "that" propane smell.

...that's a little extreme, not to mention dangerous, but sure, it's a possibility.

[Scooby Steve]

Originally Posted by matt491

I'm aware that the chemical composition is different and that it's weaker, that wasn't what I was asking! What I wanted to know was it if could possible damage the mag or gun somehow, but if it can't even cycle the slide, then I guess the answer is no, it can't.

If I could find duster that contained trifluoroethane I'd give it a try. From what I understand the stuff that's available now will gunk up your gun.

I'm just wondering if there's any way out of the crappy smell of propane, that's all. I shoot my gbb's all the time and the propane smell is startin' to get to me.

That smell is necessary as propane is odorless and it's presence wouldn't be noticed otherwise.

[Flying Squirrel]

Originally Posted by Styrak

HFC134A = Duster
Propane = Green Gas
Period.

Yes, You're right. I'm getting things confused . . I'm an idiot. Sorry everyone.

[Crunchmeister]

Originally Posted by Scooby Steve

If I could find duster that contained tetrafluoroethane I'd give it a try. From what I understand the stuff that's available now will gunk up your gun.

I've been told the duster gas they sell at The Source (Radio Shack) is tetrafluoroethane, but the others sold everywhere else are difluoroethane. I'll be dropping by there to check it out on the weekend, and if that's the case, I'll be picking up a few cans.

My WA Beretta 92FS is a duster gas gun, but on the difluoroethane, it's rather weak. I've been running it on propane, but I'm worried that it may have too much pressure. It fires, cycles and hits a LOT harder than my KJW M9 (full metal) with propane, and I'm really worried I may end up breaking the slide using propane.

I've been shooting this gun using a mix of propane and duster gas. That lowers the pressure on the slide significantly, but still gives the gun pretty decent velocity and hits pretty hard. From the sound of the BBs hitting the target with this combination, it seems to perform about as well as the KJW.

I'm hoping that trifluoroethane-based gas can give me similar performance.

[Drake]

Most dusters now are difluoroethane, which is noticeably weaker than HFC134a/trifluoroethane (thank the dumbass kiddies who were huffing the crap for that change).

Crunchmeister, I would strongly urge you NOT to use propane in a stock WA; WA GBBs are design to have quite a bit of kick using 134a, and it's just a matter of time before it gets damaged using green gas/propane.

Propane does remain the best option for powering GBBs, so you may want to look into an upgraded recoil spring guide (150%) and/or get the flow restrictor from Airsoft Innovations, which was designed to protect non-upgraded guns when using higher power gas.

I myself use a Guarder 150% recoil spring in a WA 1911, and haven't had problems using propane, but I am doing so with full knowledge I'm risking damage to the slide (I've been looking for a metal slide -- the issue has been more finding one that fits, that I like, and that isn't out of stock).

Another alternative is to mix a small amount of propane in with your duster, which I use to do on my Marui M92FS before i got a metal body kit for it. Assuming you usually fill it about 6 seconds, basically 5/6 duster + 1/6 green gas. The end result is a bit odd; you get an increase in power but very crappy "gas mileage."