V2 & V3 Drafting project.

[Bandit50]

Hey guys, I might have to get in touch with a few people in the community, buy a few new gear boxes myself. Or take apart mine one more time.. Either way...

I am trying to make a Cad/IPT file of the two different versions of airsoft gear boxes.

Version 2 and Version 3 gear boxes to be exact. I not only want to enhanced the communities understanding and knowledge of gear boxes, but provide an assembly video, and a base so others can play around with things along with myself. Example: (Like different degrees of teeth for gear sets.)

So, I was wondering if anyone in the community has scraped gear box parts, already has the dimensions recorded, or a file of sorts, or where to get files of sorts, to save me some time. Being the hobbyist I am, I would eventually like to design my own gear box that can fit standard parts, or create a rifle around the standard gear box for fun not profit.

[ThunderCactus]

If you're making a superior mechbox, look at a PTW. The planetary gearset is far more efficient and compact than the regular 3 gear setup.
Design a sector gear with 150% larger first tooth
Use a metal piston rack but make the backing strip thicker and make sure there are radii at all the valleys between teeth
Use the PTW style air nozzle that's drawn back by a polyurethane O-ring
Make it use an ASCU style controller, with a push button switch on the trigger, so built in mosfet, waterproof it too lol
and most importantly, design a GOOD ptw hop chamber for AEG's, but use the MDD adjuster system

There's tons of good ideas and mods out there, just nobody has ever put them all together into one gun before lol

[Bandit50]

Originally Posted by ThunderCactus

If you're making a superior mechbox, look at a PTW. The planetary gearset is far more efficient and compact than the regular 3 gear setup.
Design a sector gear with 150% larger first tooth
Use a metal piston rack but make the backing strip thicker and make sure there are radii at all the valleys between teeth
Use the PTW style air nozzle that's drawn back by a polyurethane O-ring
Make it use an ASCU style controller, with a push button switch on the trigger, so built in mosfet, waterproof it too lol
and most importantly, design a GOOD ptw hop chamber for AEG's, but use the MDD adjuster system

There's tons of good ideas and mods out there, just nobody has ever put them all together into one gun before lol

Ill keep all of this in mind, there was another idea I had too. Was water proof electrics. I actually want to try a spiral gear system too on a few places in the gear box.. but first thing is first, I need dimensions.. If no one has them yet, I think I will just buy new boxes and start from the grown up.

[ThunderCactus]

spiral? you mean helical or hypoid?
helical has been done, makes everything quieter, but technically adds lots of angular pressure. I havent seen an angular gearset specifically damage bearings yet, but would be a much better idea to have double helical or herring-bone gears.

[Bandit50]

Worm.. gear or drive, which ever you prefer.

[ThunderCactus]

I dont see a practical application for a worm gear, the gear ratio is way too high as per typical worm gears and you wouldn't have the room to mesh it up with another gear unless you were using a v6 box.
Also, you'd never be able to release the spring pressure since the gears cant spin free while on a worm gear. It would get around the use of an anti reversal latch very well though. Maybe if you matched it up with a ptw style optical sensor on the sector gear...
This would be for a V6 or pgc mechbox though, where you'd have the room to mesh the worm to a spur gear
For a v2 application, a hypoid gear would work, but it would be almost strictly for aesthetics.

[Bandit50]

I was thinking, direct from the motor, to the Sector gear ! Don't ask how I am going to temporarily stop the gears.. so the spring can release... I haven't gotten that far yet XD all in all that's the fun of playing with things though. Trying to find a solution for something that's more direct...

[ThunderCactus]

Thats what i thought of first as well, but I dont think theres any way to do it without making the gear very wide.
If the goal is to save space, a planetary gear set is really the best way to do it. You immediately remove on gears worth of room, and you could potentially put all 3 gears in one compact unit

[Bandit50]

The idea was to get more torque, and use less power when compressing the spring. To get more battery life. The other challenges was to allow for high PE springs, so we could effectively get more fps out of AEGs.. Thus helping AEG's get closer to gas guns.. Another idea I had was some thoughts on how to get more air from the pistons & cylinders. As it was being compressed. Now for the most part I think the after market/ Performance boosting/Upgrade field has this covered.

That was my real goal tho more battery life, with less power consuming motors, thus not needing a 11.1v motor with lipo battery to handle parts.. I mean the only real reason people upgrade gears anyways is because the standard gears can't take the torque.

[Cobrajr122]

Originally Posted by Bandit50

The other challenges was to allow for high PE springs, so we could effectively get more fps out of AEGs. Thus helping AEG's get closer to gas guns.

AEGs can already easily match gas guns for muzzle energy, and far surpass most of them in consistency and ROF.

When we have field limits on muzzle energy though, and all variants of ASG can easily match and surpass those limits, why try to go even higher? HS5 has already broken the sound barrier.

[Bandit50]

It's very simple why, because I want to play around with things for fun !

I am aware of field limits, I just want to try to make something that works better for fun. Do not get me wrong good sir. I just want to, because I can

Consider for a moment, having a 3D Image. Rather, an exploded view drawing of a gear box.... I know people would love them for there field, shop, and rooms. "I" would personally not charge anything for them I just want to for fun.

That's what this whole thread was about, helping me do something for fun.. and it helps the community. Which "I" will give the finished product back to the community....for free for helping. In fact cactus has helped.



To also add, you missed the other part of that sentence you quoted The "other challenge".... now your putting words in my mouth and highlighting what you thought I said.

You also missed that part of that post where i said."The idea was to get more torque, and use less power when compressing the spring. To get more battery life. The other challenges was to allow for high PE springs, so we could effectively get more fps out of AEGs.. Thus helping AEG's get closer to gas guns.

and....

That was my real goal tho more battery life, with less power consuming motors, thus not needing a 11.1v motor with lipo battery to handle parts

Yes, I am trying to get AEG like gas guns, more bang for less of a buck.. by which I mean cheaper gear boxes, less parts needed, more power.. Makes sense?

[Bandit50]

Here, for more fun i'll post something quick In this forum of some of the work I have already done.. under an "Edit: "

Edit: See, fun (To add, this is where all of the CAD Photos for this project, will be listed under this thread.)







So, I have the parts I need to start drafting, and thus it has began! Even more to come soon.


Edit: I just ended up buying my own gear box, I will measuring things down the (0.0001") and using the sin bar if needed ... I'm not excited about that part.... Wish I had a protractor that measured in degrees, minutes and seconds. What do you think cactus? .65, .88 or .73 carbon steel for the gears.. I want something flexibility.. but I also want something hard : / maybe ill just make gears and temper them like they temper a good sword. Nah....maybe ill just buy the parts, piece by piece and just make a decent gear box at the same time. Yeah, I like that plan better I could use raffle the gear box, or use it...and then the community gets a drawing out of it... A GDT drawing!!!

[ThunderCactus]

Efficiency is better on full auto. My 249 is geared to run efficient full auto and it does over 7bb/mah at its best.
If you want efficiency, focus on the motor.
A well tuned ptw does about .6-.7mah per bb

[K3vX]

Two things.

If you want to experiment with airsoft, you should head to http://forums.airsoftmechanics.com/

If you want a cad file of a gearbox, good luck. The few people that succeeded in doing a *good* gearbox, are holding preciously on the file. "MtHaynes" is an example of this. He was producing true CNC gearboxes, and won't disclose the file, unless you have a rather large bank account.

[Bandit50]

Originally Posted by K3vX

Two things.

If you want to experiment with airsoft, you should head to http://forums.airsoftmechanics.com/

If you want a cad file of a gearbox, good luck. The few people that succeeded in doing a *good* gearbox, are holding preciously on the file. "MtHaynes" is an example of this. He was producing true CNC gearboxes, and won't disclose the file, unless you have a rather large bank account.

In the words of heero yuy, "Mission Accepted." Yup, done. I'll be sure to give the community a 3d exploded drawing then.. once I get some free money, and in between season maintenance. I will be sure to buy/measure some parts to get this all drafted.

Oh well, I knew there were a few people with these files. That's Why I was asking if a few wanted to just give me some basic dimensions to help get started.

Oh well thats kind of half of the fun of doing this, measuring and creating parts yourself. Thanks K3vX, and ThunderCactus for some words of encouragement Keep you all posted how the projects going.