mounting optics to hi capa without drilling

[p.phresh]

what are my options for mounting optics on my hi capa without drilling holes in the frame and without mounting via the accessory rail?

[Thenooblord]

mounted in the rear sight dovetails

[Styrak]

Not much. Like nooblord said the only other option is on the rear sight mount (which just adds a bunch of weight to the slide, horrible idea) or getting one of those mounts that uses the slide catch hole. I think you lose slide catch ability with that but if you're making a race gun people don't usually care.

[Thenooblord]

like styrak says, it does add weight to the slide, but they are still pretty lightweight, and its the most precise way to mount an optic, being closes to the bore and mounted to the slide instead of the frame

[MultipleParadox]

There are relatively new mouts available that screws where top grip screw and has another one that goes through the frame, replacing the slide catch; no drilling required.

They look just the same as the one that requires drilling so they won't add weight to the frame either

Needless to say you loose the slidecatch functionality but it works

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by Thenooblord

like styrak says, it does add weight to the slide, but they are still pretty lightweight, and its the most precise way to mount an optic, being closes to the bore and mounted to the slide instead of the frame

I prefer to disagree. Slide mounted optics are difficult to track, because the sight is moving with the slide. It's why I generally don't use such a setup for myself. Others might like it, but I find it harder to track than a frame mounted sight.

My personal experience on the matter:


Regarding Styrak's comment on weight - yes, it does add weight. In my own setup, I've paired it with a hybrid setup, so the added weight is countered by the weight saved from the rib cutout:



At the end of the day, the weight differences are almost negligible, but if you're looking to build a bleeding edge performance setup with lightning fast cycling rates, any form of slide mounted optics are what you want to avoid.

Melted-in optics will get you closest to bore, and you can even get them to co-witness with iron sights, but this will require custom fabrication. If you can't handle drilling in to the frame, then there's no way you'll be able to do a melt-in. These are pure custom jobs. However, this still has the same problem with having to track a moving dot.



With a good frame mount, you can get optics just as low, or even lower to the sight bore than with a simple rear sight replacement. For example, 90 degree mounted CMore mounts can put the side of the lens almost touching against the slide. You can't get any lower than that, although, it will increase the bulkiness of your overall gun:



If you absolutely do not want to mount to the frame (I'm not sure why not - it's the most stable option available), as styrak mentioned, there are quick detach models that replace the slide catch, such as the ones sold by ILLusion Kinetics / Airsoft Surgeon, etc.:

http://www.redwolfairsoft.com/redwol...r_Now_font.htm

That's just one of the many styles available for the two main optics platforms (CMore and DocterSight.)

Nine Ball also has a similar QD solution that just puts a Picatinny rail on as the attachment point. In my opinion, these are the worst solutions, as it place the optic lens much higher off the rail than any dedicated solution, as you will have to factor in both the mount base, as well as the optic's rail mount. This will add a minimum of 6mm of extra distance, creating greater parallax issues and a greater need for muscle memory re-training:



The Nine Ball scope mount base has an extra level of stability, as it utilizes the top grip screw as a secondary mounting point. It will be a lot of extra bulk on the side of the gun that you'll have to deal with. This side of the gun would normally be where you would be bracing your hand against the gun to manage recoil. They're the least comfortable option I've listed.

The Nine Ball option is the most expensive of all these, followed by the ILLusion Kinetics options (QD), and then frame mounted ILLusion Kinetics mounts. The cheapest, would be rear sight adapters.

There are several clones of these latter products now. I'm not familiar with the exact brands and models that are available, but I'm aware of Silverback releasing a rear sight dovetail adapter that's built like the ILLusion Kinetics ones. I believe 5KU has cloned the IK QD mounts as well.

There are even QD 90 degree CMore mounts, if you want both a low sight-over-bore, a large viewable lens, and no frame drilling.

[Thenooblord]

well I only said it was the most precise, I didnt say it was any better, its just the most precise because its not got slide to frame play cause its fixed to the slide, and its the closest possible to the bore axis (excliuding illusions examples above, RE sideways c more)

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by Thenooblord

well I only said it was the most precise, I didnt say it was any better, its just the most precise because its not got slide to frame play to counter with, and its the closest possible to the bore axis

This is true. You effectively remove one error variable. As long as you maintain a good barrel to slide fitment, your point of aim : point of impact should remain the same.

[p.phresh]

I've had experience with the silverback slide mounted optic on my Glock and I really did not like it.

I'm not too keen on drilling into my ProG4 frame at the moment so I'd like to opt for the QD mounts. My gun is short stroked so I don't really care about losing the slide stop.

Illusion, I'd be interested in one of those QD mounts you carry. Do you have any in stock at the moment?

[Shirley]

Yeah what Illusions has is a RS Doctor sight. Try a replica with it and you'll cry. It's a good clean set up, but very hard.
Luckily when I ordered my IMM from IK, I got them to do the custom drill/tap/thread the frame with the mount so it's perfectly even.
Man, I love my RS C-more too.

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by p.phresh

I've had experience with the silverback slide mounted optic on my Glock and I really did not like it.

What about it did you not like?

Originally Posted by p.phresh

Illusion, I'd be interested in one of those QD mounts you carry. Do you have any in stock at the moment?

I generally don't carry these, because I don't recommend them. They will have a tiny bit of play relative to your frame, because the mount is never 100% solid.

I have one QD mount here that I've been playing with - meant for use with a DocterSight. It's "okay", but still not ideal. They're good for guns that you want to use between Standard Division and Open Division. Beyond that, I can't recommend them for any permanent setup.

I suppose I should stock them, since there is a demand on them. Like you, there are a lot of users that are afraid of drilling & tapping their frame, or just don't have the tools to do it - and are unwilling to pay someone to do it properly for them.

Again, the only one I have on hand, is a DocterSight model. If you want that, I can flip that to you for a discounted price since I've fiddled with it. Otherwise, I can order one in for you, but would need some lead time on it. I just need to know what optics you want to use it with (Cmore or Doctersight), and I'll send you some links. I can get it in about 2 weeks. I'm placing an order tonight for other items, so let me know asap if you want in on this.

[p.phresh]

yeah I didn't like the slide mounted docter sight because I had trouble tracking it from shot to shot and I ditched it and went back to my iron sights.

I have tried Cmore mounts on my friends' race guns and I found it a lot easier to use and preferred it. if you've got that extra mount I'll take it off your hands if it isn't all butchered up.

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by p.phresh

I have tried Cmore mounts on my friends' race guns and I found it a lot easier to use and preferred it. if you've got that extra mount I'll take it off your hands if it isn't all butchered up.

Unfortunately, I don't have CMore QD mounts on hand. Only that Doctersight one that I'd been fiddling with. I'd have to order in a CMore one for you.