TM M3 Super 90 feeding problem

TheToastmaster · June 1st, 2005, 03:22

Anyone with experience with the internals of the TM M3 Super 90... Mine's got a problem, that I think requires a replacement part.

On Sunday I took my M3 to my first outdoor scrims and it performed beautifully (as the shotty always has indoors) until around the end when it would pump fully back, but would not return forward with the usual click. I could push it almost all the way forward, but not quite, and it felt as though it had something stuck inside. After a few pushes forward and back on the pump (not roughly, I know better than to force things- I've heard horror stories about the fragility of this gun) and a few shakes, it pumped properly and fired normally, but on the next pump the same thing happened.
At this point I left the game and took a look at it through the loading port (where the shell goes in) with the shell in and the shell out. It dryfires fine, but whenever bbs are in it, it jams that same way, though after enough shaking, it will fire properly. I've heard of this very problem happening to other people with this gun, so it seems to be a chronic thing, probably some silly design flaw...

I've opened it up, and have found that the piece on the piston that pushes the BBs into the barrel by the hop-up is probably the problem. I've fiddled with it with the reciever all off with the piston exposed, and have found that whenever BBs get up where they're supposed to be along that triple latch piece (I can't think what else to call it -it's M3-7 on the diagram), one decides that it should be in between the three barrels on the piston head (can't think what else to call this part either -2 on the diagram), and the head can't move forward like it's supposed to.

The top one also has a bb shaped indentation that I thought at first was to help guide the top BB into position, since it's so perfectly centred and symmetrical, but I've decided that it's probably that the top part is deformed from a jammed BB. If someone can confirm that all 3 tubes that extend from that piece are supposed to be identical (I'd assume that they should be to get equal air pressure) that'd help, since I hadn't seen them before I opened up my shotty.

Better picture at: http://www.airsoftplayers.com/m3/m35.jpg

The part circled in red is the problem, as far as I can tell. I hope I can find a replacement if there isn't a way to fix it... I may even be able to fix it by filling some epoxy in where the BB is getting stuck, but I don't know how closely this part needs to seal to work.
Thanks.

The Saint · June 1st, 2005, 03:38

Oh no, not again. This is a problem that happens to all many TM shottys. For whatever reason, a BB sometimes misfeeds and ends up loose in the tri-nozzle area, then deforms one of the tri-nozzle when the user tries to rack it again.

Um, here http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...ght=m3+problem and here http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...hotgun+problem

There are more threads on it if you do a bit more searching. There's also a site by someone named Inferno on how you can fix it, but I can't seem to find it right now...

Stories like these really makes me less inclined to buy a M3 as my first weapon. I don't mind the challenge of gaming with its limitations, but I hate the thought of it breaking so easily.

No_Way · June 1st, 2005, 03:45

I have one and never the gun do this to me, always babyed my gun.....And well lubbed !

Mike the great · June 1st, 2005, 04:31

try here

http://infernogmbh.iwarp.com/photo6.html

scroll down

TheToastmaster · June 1st, 2005, 21:17

That's exactly the problem. I was pretty sure it was, but like I said, I wasn't sure if the nozzle was supposed to be indented the way that it is.
Oddly (and luckily) the top nozzle on mine isn't cracked at all, it's just dented in. That page that shows a way to fix it helps, since I was also wondering how tight that part needs to seal in behind the BBs to fire right. It doesn't look like it has to fit terribly tightly. I'm going to look into getting the part reproduced in metal if I can, if not I'll just mod it with a metal tube I think.

No_Way: I've babied mine too, and I have only just used it enough to merit lubing recently.

It's lucky that it's not that hard a problem to fix from the looks of things, because my shotty is pretty darn new, and it's a really stupid problem to have happening right off the bat...

Thanks a lot guys, I'll look out for repacements for this part, or if I can fix it myself, I'll post something about it.
Does anyone know if the SPAS 12 uses the same parts for the piston assembly as the M3? If it does, it may be easier to find parts.

The Saint · June 1st, 2005, 21:45

I thought SPAS and M3 have the exact same internals.

TheToastmaster · June 1st, 2005, 22:23

It looks like they do, I checked the manual for the SPAS 12 posted the same place as the M3 one I linked to, and they look the same. I'm just wondering if anyone has experience with both that can say that they're the same.

SOCOM · July 1st, 2005, 13:32

i dont know if this will help but heres a site http://forum.21stcenturyairsoft.com/about222.html
hope you fix it.(this was on another site so i guess it wont, sorry)

TheToastmaster · July 2nd, 2005, 19:34

I've seen that one, it's not a bad fix. I'm replicating it roughly, but with metal parts. I'll post how it it works when it's done.

TheToastmaster · August 14th, 2005, 17:30

It previously wasn't, but this part is now available on the WGC site as well as Dentrinity, the news also has a new metal replacement up on it, so we'll soon see how those are.
I'd post a link, but all of WGCshop.com comes up for me as the same page, so a seach should pull it up.

TheToastmaster · November 8th, 2005, 13:54

I've gotten my box of parts from the latest WGC group order and it looks like WGC does not have replacement cylinders, but a part labelled with the same number as the cylinders.
Good thing, I bought 4 for when the new cylinders packed in as they tend to do in TM M3's, so I have extras!
Damn them and their not posting pictures of all of their items!

I hope I'm the only one who ordered this part (or 4 of them, for that matter)

HGI · November 9th, 2005, 19:54

I talked to a guy on OP-For.ca who have worked with both spas and m3 and he told me they both have the same internals.

siufay · November 9th, 2005, 20:09

they do have same internals..but the thing is that the problem is mostly from the m3 and not the spas..

markedman · November 9th, 2005, 23:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by siufay

they do have same internals..but the thing is that the problem is mostly from the m3 and not the spas..

For what its worth, The reason this happens more to the M3 is that there are more being sold then the spas.

Statistically this is bound to happen more. Putting the metal nozzle on is a good upgrade

TheToastmaster · November 9th, 2005, 23:26

Are there any cases anyone's heard of of it happening to a SPAS, though?
I've only heard of it happening to the M3, even though the internals are the same...

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June 1st, 2005, 03:22	#1
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	TM M3 Super 90 feeding problem Anyone with experience with the internals of the TM M3 Super 90... Mine's got a problem, that I think requires a replacement part. On Sunday I took my M3 to my first outdoor scrims and it performed beautifully (as the shotty always has indoors) until around the end when it would pump fully back, but would not return forward with the usual click. I could push it almost all the way forward, but not quite, and it felt as though it had something stuck inside. After a few pushes forward and back on the pump (not roughly, I know better than to force things- I've heard horror stories about the fragility of this gun) and a few shakes, it pumped properly and fired normally, but on the next pump the same thing happened. At this point I left the game and took a look at it through the loading port (where the shell goes in) with the shell in and the shell out. It dryfires fine, but whenever bbs are in it, it jams that same way, though after enough shaking, it will fire properly. I've heard of this very problem happening to other people with this gun, so it seems to be a chronic thing, probably some silly design flaw... I've opened it up, and have found that the piece on the piston that pushes the BBs into the barrel by the hop-up is probably the problem. I've fiddled with it with the reciever all off with the piston exposed, and have found that whenever BBs get up where they're supposed to be along that triple latch piece (I can't think what else to call it -it's M3-7 on the diagram), one decides that it should be in between the three barrels on the piston head (can't think what else to call this part either -2 on the diagram), and the head can't move forward like it's supposed to. The top one also has a bb shaped indentation that I thought at first was to help guide the top BB into position, since it's so perfectly centred and symmetrical, but I've decided that it's probably that the top part is deformed from a jammed BB. If someone can confirm that all 3 tubes that extend from that piece are supposed to be identical (I'd assume that they should be to get equal air pressure) that'd help, since I hadn't seen them before I opened up my shotty. Better picture at: http://www.airsoftplayers.com/m3/m35.jpg The part circled in red is the problem, as far as I can tell. I hope I can find a replacement if there isn't a way to fix it... I may even be able to fix it by filling some epoxy in where the BB is getting stuck, but I don't know how closely this part needs to seal to work. Thanks. __________________ Toast

June 1st, 2005, 03:38	#2
The Saint Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Quebec	Oh no, not again. This is a problem that happens to all many TM shottys. For whatever reason, a BB sometimes misfeeds and ends up loose in the tri-nozzle area, then deforms one of the tri-nozzle when the user tries to rack it again. Um, here http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...ght=m3+problem and here http://www.airsoftcanada.com/showthr...hotgun+problem There are more threads on it if you do a bit more searching. There's also a site by someone named Inferno on how you can fix it, but I can't seem to find it right now... Stories like these really makes me less inclined to buy a M3 as my first weapon. I don't mind the challenge of gaming with its limitations, but I hate the thought of it breaking so easily. __________________ "The Bird of Hermes is My Name, Eating My Wings to Make Me Tame."

June 1st, 2005, 21:17	#5
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	That's exactly the problem. I was pretty sure it was, but like I said, I wasn't sure if the nozzle was supposed to be indented the way that it is. Oddly (and luckily) the top nozzle on mine isn't cracked at all, it's just dented in. That page that shows a way to fix it helps, since I was also wondering how tight that part needs to seal in behind the BBs to fire right. It doesn't look like it has to fit terribly tightly. I'm going to look into getting the part reproduced in metal if I can, if not I'll just mod it with a metal tube I think. No_Way: I've babied mine too, and I have only just used it enough to merit lubing recently. It's lucky that it's not that hard a problem to fix from the looks of things, because my shotty is pretty darn new, and it's a really stupid problem to have happening right off the bat... Thanks a lot guys, I'll look out for repacements for this part, or if I can fix it myself, I'll post something about it. Does anyone know if the SPAS 12 uses the same parts for the piston assembly as the M3? If it does, it may be easier to find parts. __________________ Toast

June 1st, 2005, 03:45	#3
No_Way Trader rating Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: St-Romuald , Qc	I have one and never the gun do this to me, always babyed my gun.....And well lubbed !

June 1st, 2005, 04:31	#4
Mike the great Trader rating Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Calgary,AB	try here http://infernogmbh.iwarp.com/photo6.html scroll down

June 1st, 2005, 21:45	#6
The Saint Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Quebec	I thought SPAS and M3 have the exact same internals. __________________ "The Bird of Hermes is My Name, Eating My Wings to Make Me Tame."

June 1st, 2005, 22:23	#7
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	It looks like they do, I checked the manual for the SPAS 12 posted the same place as the M3 one I linked to, and they look the same. I'm just wondering if anyone has experience with both that can say that they're the same. __________________ Toast

July 1st, 2005, 13:32	#8
SOCOM Trader rating Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Calgary	i dont know if this will help but heres a site http://forum.21stcenturyairsoft.com/about222.html hope you fix it.(this was on another site so i guess it wont, sorry)

July 2nd, 2005, 19:34	#9
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	I've seen that one, it's not a bad fix. I'm replicating it roughly, but with metal parts. I'll post how it it works when it's done. __________________ Toast

August 14th, 2005, 17:30	#10
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	It previously wasn't, but this part is now available on the WGC site as well as Dentrinity, the news also has a new metal replacement up on it, so we'll soon see how those are. I'd post a link, but all of WGCshop.com comes up for me as the same page, so a seach should pull it up. __________________ Toast

November 8th, 2005, 13:54	#11
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	I've gotten my box of parts from the latest WGC group order and it looks like WGC does not have replacement cylinders, but a part labelled with the same number as the cylinders. Good thing, I bought 4 for when the new cylinders packed in as they tend to do in TM M3's, so I have extras! Damn them and their not posting pictures of all of their items! I hope I'm the only one who ordered this part (or 4 of them, for that matter) __________________ Toast

November 9th, 2005, 20:09	#13
siufay Trader rating Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Vancouver	they do have same internals..but the thing is that the problem is mostly from the m3 and not the spas.. __________________ Believe it or not...I'm the girl in my avatar...

November 9th, 2005, 23:26	#15
TheToastmaster Trader rating Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Winnipeg. In a hole.	Are there any cases anyone's heard of of it happening to a SPAS, though? I've only heard of it happening to the M3, even though the internals are the same... __________________ Toast

TM M3 Super 90 feeding problem

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