Year Of The GBBR....or just a stinky smell that's passing through...

[safx]

LOL, watch out Saint's got his WE
lightsaber out once again and he's
a swingin'! At some point you've
got to get tired of telling everyone
how right you are, and how wrong
the rest of us poor mortals are.

Someone explain to me how the WA
design is flawed. From my point of
view they designed a model collectable
just like they always do. It was made
for duster plinking as mentioned but
the masses saw it, got excited and
demanded more. So began revolution;
clones, licensed makers and of course
others who use them as a base to
design their own ie: WE

Lets get back to the pros, cons and
build ideas, not fight over which you
proudly support. If the WE is solid I will
own one, it's that simple. Now get out
there and wear them out so I can make
up my mind!

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by safx

LOL, watch out Saint's got his WE
lightsaber out once again and he's
a swingin'! At some point you've
got to get tired of telling everyone
how right you are, and how wrong
the rest of us poor mortals are.

I think we're well past the point of that joke being funny, man.

[RacingManiac]

As WA is designed for duster in Japan, the plastic body and the duster rated seal is fine for that. The "problem" really happens after we started using propane on them. And that was the base of the issue. WA system is fairly simple, the lower is fairly similar to a RS layout and it works for the most part, with the added stress of the propane power you need them to be more robust and thats why WOC runs steel internal. And the added pressure demends differently on the seal so different magazine seals are used in WOC mag and bolt. The essential design are the same as that in WA, just rated for propane. Really aside from those that needs to be address for use of different gas, the upgrades are not "needed" per se. I think 95% of the other issues stems from the mix of part tolerance either from parts between brand, or just bad tolerance. Which WE and airsoft in general suffers as well.......Magazine though is still not solved, as this is probably the one trillionth time I mentioned that....

BTW, one of the reason why KSC MP7A1 is great, is that it works with no issue.....

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by The Saint

The availability of aftermarket parts is not always a positive. What people should consider is whether a product can stand on itself own, or is it being propped up by a lot of other products.

The WA system is not blessed with aftermarket parts because of its popularity, on the contrary it needs all the aftermarket internal and external parts to be a viable platform because the WA system was designed to be a plastic gun running off duster. Just as crucially, WA itself has done zero refinement/revision and offers no technical support I know of.

The WE system does not need all the aftermarket internals and external parts because it was designed to be a metal gun supporting up to CO2 out of the box, and WE itself continues to refine/revise each generation so there's continuous system growth and maturity. In addition, WE offers a reasonable degree of technical support. So even if there were a ton of aftermarket parts for the WE, there still would be very few reasons to buy them. Finally, out of the box, the WE system even seems to have received some positive feedback from the mil/LE training ilk.

I'll probably one-night stand a WA, but I'll marry a WE.

I sure haven't seen any positive feedback for the WE from any MIL/LE, care to show me?

Users of the WE, if anything are quite dissapointed. Between poorly made parts (that still cost a pretty penny) and limited aftermarket parts, the WE loses quite a lot of points. The GBB system looks nice, performs nice, but isn't the realist system people wanted (thats why you see a LOT more WA/AGm/G&P/INO on the fields).

It's a nice system, but i sure wouldn't get one, nor recommend one. It's price is also a major turn off.

Oh and with a new nozzle + flute valve from ra-tech, i enjoy full propane use with my AGM.

So outside Canada... $150 AGM + $80 aftermarket parts (throw in another $30 if you want a G&P buffer + buffer spring + WA bolt catch) and you have a fully gamable GBBR.
In Canada they go for ~$500, a WE goes for what, $1000? $1200? lol

To each their own, but i'll always recommend a AGM or INO over a WE to people asking me. Unless you want a SCAR... then you 'have' to get a WE

But personally, i wouldn't mind seeing other rifles. Like some GBBR Ak's, G36's and maybe MP5's

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by Ronan

I sure haven't seen any positive feedback for the WE from any MIL/LE, care to show me?

http://www.weairsoft.com/video.php

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by The Saint

http://www.weairsoft.com/video.php

Oh god its the same crap from the youtube promotion. Fail.

I'm pretty sure even TM did that at some point. SystemA did it a couple times also.

[Daiviet]

Originally Posted by Ronan

To each their own, but i'll always recommend a AGM or INO over a WE to people asking me. Unless you want a SCAR... then you 'have' to get a WE

VFC is putting out a GBBR SCAR soon, its in production from what I remember. Found it on WGC. They're also coming out with M4's as well as per their website http://www.gb-tech.com.tw/

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by Daiviet

VFC is putting out a GBBR SCAR soon, its in production from what I remember. Found it on WGC

Now that just hit me in the right spots!

[kullwarrior]

Originally Posted by Daiviet

VFC is putting out a GBBR SCAR soon, its in production from what I remember. Found it on WGC. They're also coming out with M4's as well as per their website http://www.gb-tech.com.tw/

dude have you seen the you tube vid of VFC Scar? failed during demo as parts were falling apart as the guy hold the gun when he talks.

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by kullwarrior

dude have you seen the you tube vid of VFC Scar? failed during demo as parts were falling apart as the guy hold the gun when he talks.

Shows us And prototypes rarely work the way you want.

[The Saint]

Originally Posted by Ronan

Oh god its the same crap from the youtube promotion. Fail.

I'm pretty sure even TM did that at some point. SystemA did it a couple times also.

I don't see how having real steel users comment on it is "crap".

I know of no instance of TM stating that they gave real steel shooters the opportunity to test/comment on their AEGs in a training weapon capacity. You might be thinking of something else.

[Daiviet]

Originally Posted by kullwarrior

dude have you seen the you tube vid of VFC Scar? failed during demo as parts were falling apart as the guy hold the gun when he talks.

thats probably why it hasn't reached its august 2009 release date like it says on the bottom left of that picture.

I trust VFC will make it proper, I haven't really seen them put out a crappy product so far.

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by The Saint

I don't see how having real steel users comment on it is "crap".

I know of no instance of TM stating that they gave real steel shooters the opportunity to test/comment on their AEGs in a training weapon capacity. You might be thinking of something else.

They are paid by WE to make it look better than what it is. Until theirs a third party test done, then it has to be taken with a grain of salt.

+if MIL/LE would use a GBBR it would be the Inokatsu with its high grade materials, not the WE with its airsoft grade parts.

[Beowulfe]

Originally Posted by Ronan

But personally, i wouldn't mind seeing other rifles. Like some GBBR Ak's, G36's and maybe MP5's

Isn't KWC developing a G36?

[KEVORKIAN]

Originally Posted by Ronan

+if MIL/LE would use a GBBR it would be the Inokatsu with its high grade materials, not the WE with its airsoft grade parts.

Inokatsu = FAIL
...this gun still leaves a bad taste in my mouth!