systema m4 worth it?

[Lakonian]

Oh, one thing I love/hate is the cheek pads.

Mine felt really nice when they were on, and intact.... but they got marred up preeettyyy bad.

However, now that they're off, the rifle feels like a weapon, and not a training weapon. Very pretty with the groove leveled out too. Looks authentic LMT.

[walks]

as a friend of mine said "for that price I'll get a real m4 a few mags and a case of ammo" yes it is about the money thing, I've tried a friends befor , liked the fact that there was no trigger lag and it was solid and had the finnish similar to a real m4 but as said befor i can upgrade a cheaper gun to run solid for the rest of my time playing airsoft and use the same mags as all my other AR models.

I guess it all boils down to cost and practicality

[Ronan]

Originally Posted by Field_Gunner

as a friend of mine said "for that price I'll get a real m4 a few mags and a case of ammo" yes it is about the money thing, I've tried a friends befor , liked the fact that there was no trigger lag and it was solid and had the finnish similar to a real m4 but as said befor i can upgrade a cheaper gun to run solid for the rest of my time playing airsoft and use the same mags as all my other AR models.

I guess it all boils down to cost and practicality

Good for him as long he doesn't go to a AIRSOFT game with it...

[ancorp]

Originally Posted by mcguyver

Sure I could. But can make it CQB-ready in 15 seconds if I'm slow. Or I could make 430 fps. Same gun, same mags. Nothing else changes but the cylinder. And, I can get 2500 rounds out of a 9.6v 1600mah battery at 430 fps. I used to have to carry 2 spare 9.6v 3000mah in my G&P SPR to do the same job, and at less velocity.

...

What about something such as the ICS split mechbox? That allows for fast velocity changes.

As for carrying 2 spare (thus 3 total) 3000mah batteries to get 2500 rounds, that's just can't be right. Either your batteries were in horrible condition, or the gun was.

[Skladfin]

I seriously don't think it's worth it.

PTW doesn't make you a better player, period.

I've seriously killed so many PTW users it's not even funny... Everytime I just tell them "why'd u get it man, look, I'm using a $300 China clone!"

[Jayhad]

well to add my 2 cents I am really won over now with my PRO-WIN. I am into the gun for $1000 and I can shoot as good as a PTW if not better. Anyone in alberta is able to test me on this when I enter a game.

Our team ASA has 5 PTW and 4 Pro-wins, both perform at about the same failure rate... rarely. Actually we haven't had a PRO-WIN failure yet (after intial build bugs were worked out.... which you don't get with QC PTWs) but we have had a few PTW issues.

With the PRO-WIN we can do a spring change in 30 seconds and spend less cash.

Personally myself if you want an ultra reliable gun and you are on some what of a budget go the PRO-WIN.

[ILLusion]

Originally Posted by Skladfin

I seriously don't think it's worth it.

PTW doesn't make you a better player, period.

I've seriously killed so many PTW users it's not even funny... Everytime I just tell them "why'd u get it man, look, I'm using a $300 China clone!"

Who says buying a PTW makes you a better player?

I think anybody who believes that having a more expensive toy will make you a better player is a moron.

[bruce]

Brian, you can't call Skladfin a moron. He kills PTW players by the Boat Full. He's the Airsoft God and I'm glad I don't play in Vancouver because I don't want to get killed by him all the time.

[mcguyver]

Originally Posted by ancorp

What about something such as the ICS split mechbox? That allows for fast velocity changes.

As for carrying 2 spare (thus 3 total) 3000mah batteries to get 2500 rounds, that's just can't be right. Either your batteries were in horrible condition, or the gun was.

Yep, ICS does make a split mechbox, But without extensive upgrades, the gun would not run reliably at velocitites higher than 400 fps, which was really pushing it. And, I had 2 alternate uppers, batteries and was still $1500 into an ICS, not including mags, rail, etc.

The G&P shot 450 fps out of the box, and with the Systema silent head set gave me about 420 fps and 1100-1200 rounds on a battery. It did it right from new. Notice the batteries were NiMH? They are not the best for current discharge, NiCad still rules there, but not as easy to find. The EG700 available in the G&P took a shit-kicking running the load the gun came with (from the factory), and the battery usage showed that. So again, it would have taken more money invested into a $1000 gun to improve the situation, when a PTW cost me $1750 (factory assembled). And the G&P packed it in at about 15,000 rounds, and it lasted longer than the other 3 SPRs locally.

I find today how many people complain "Oh, but the mags are so expensive, and the batteries ae ridiculous", and these are not older, more experienced players. How many guys remember when Marui lo-caps cost $50 each, or a standard 8.4v large battery was $75? It was only a couple of years ago, before the clones came out. That was the situation, and not many choices there. How many guys still say "you need $1000 to get into airsoft"? This is from the same era, but the reality now is about $400. So I can see why people who entered this sport last year can say a PTW is expensive. It really isn't, when you're used to dumping $1500 into a gun no problem, and still get mediocre performance and have to fix the thing all the time because you're mixing and matching parts with different specs. That is the way it used to be, and still would be if you bought quality parts and built up a gun from a Marui base, which is how it used to be done, and still is for some guys.

[jameskersten]

Originally Posted by Skladfin

I seriously don't think it's worth it.

PTW doesn't make you a better player, period.

I've seriously killed so many PTW users it's not even funny... Everytime I just tell them "why'd u get it man, look, I'm using a $300 China clone!"

seriously good for you, I don't think I have ever met anyone with a PTW who thinks he can't be beat by someone with a China Clone. We don't get a "no die card" when we buy the gun.No one is claiming that, we still need to play the game and play well to use the weapon to its potential just like you do with your ak but its a choice that some make and are very happy with and some who don't and are happy with their clone. Either way, who cares? I am more then happy with my PTW and my ICS. But guess what gun hasn't been used in the past 6months other then to lend out? Sorry man, I think I know where your coming from but I get so sick of hearing non-ptw users bash the gun without what I feel is a viable reason. Particularly when no ptw user I know tries to push the " you must have a ptw to compete" additute, I think thats something that non-users think we try to push. I just want to play the game, have fun and I have the money to buy one, so I liked the feel of one, how it shot, the versatility of one so I bought one and don't regret it one bit.

[Skladfin]

Originally Posted by jameskersten

seriously good for you, I don't think I have ever met anyone with a PTW who thinks he can't be beat by someone with a China Clone. We don't get a "no die card" when we buy the gun.No one is claiming that, we still need to play the game and play well to use the weapon to its potential just like you do with your ak but its a choice that some make and are very happy with and some who don't and are happy with their clone. Either way, who cares? I am more then happy with my PTW and my ICS. But guess what gun hasn't been used in the past 6months other then to lend out? Sorry man, I think I know where your coming from but I get so sick of hearing non-ptw users bash the gun without what I feel is a viable reason. Particularly when no ptw user I know tries to push the " you must have a ptw to compete" additute, I think thats something that non-users think we try to push. I just want to play the game, have fun and I have the money to buy one, so I liked the feel of one, how it shot, the versatility of one so I bought one and don't regret it one bit.

I see, you got a point there, I guess it's more true coming from the owner itself.

[Lakonian]

Originally Posted by Skladfin

I seriously don't think it's worth it.

PTW doesn't make you a better player, period.

I've seriously killed so many PTW users it's not even funny... Everytime I just tell them "why'd u get it man, look, I'm using a $300 China clone!"

Okay, let's clear up one big misconception.

We're not ALL Ronan. lol.

Secondly, I, and like 80% of the PTW owners I know chose to purchase this gun, as it's the most accurate (in terms of functionality, and appearance) AEG on the market. The mags are realistically weighted, and give you a better idea of what you'd be dealing with on the field. AND ofcourse the gimmicky quickchange spring.

You can't say the PTW makes you a better player-that'd be silly. But saying that it'll give you better muscle memory, and help you develop better trigger control makes sense. It is a TRAINING weapon, is it not? lol..

[Endymion]

Good lord...

Is Inokatsu worth it? Is Western Arms worth it? Is JG worth it? AGM? How about that crack whore at hooker Harveys who gives great head for $20? Is she worth it?

It is all personal preference. It is personal cost/reward justification. If you enjoy it and it brings you satisfaction to own without putting you into unmanageable debt, then it's worth it. You need to define what "worth" means to you. Forget performance, aesthetics, appeal, or your own personal skill. There are collectors here who will probably never field a PTW but who might own one. If someone is happy owning one, then it's worth it for that person. This kind of topic is older and fouler than grandma's fortnight old unchanged knickers.

[KhaosGott]

All depends on what you prefere.

For me, if Systema made an AK, I'd be on that like white on rice.

[Skladfin]

Originally Posted by kos

Okay, let's clear up one big misconception.

We're not ALL Ronan. lol.

that made me laugh lol

and ya, I do agree the quick spring change is great to have.