Airsoft and Painball Debate

[rockafella]

Oye Wildcard, pinoy ka ba?

Yeah, the other thing I love about these guns is that they were actually originally manufactured by the a factory commisioned by the PRC to make a effective yet affordable taining sim for thier Mil forces to train with. And as such they are being used in training by over 50 law enforcement and Military agencies globally. And since the only reason I play airsoft/paintball is to augment my military training (CF infantry) this as close as I can get to the real deal, at least when we're not prcticing w/ sims at Wighnwright.

Originally Posted by wildcard

I was kind of skeptical when I first saw these RAP4 but after playing with them with a bunch of guys out in FT McMurray I was hooked, Finally a marker that can take any punishment I dish out on it and after doing a little research on it I discovered that some of my friends out in H.K and in the Phillipines Have been playing with them for some years now and ALL of them gave the RAP4 METS a glowing review and the fact that these guys can almost get anything they want their review counts more than any review board.

I've own JAC, AEG and pretty much All of the WA, maruzen and Tanaka Blowback, as real or these "guns" get they are still the fragile and durability issue to these guns, I mean there is probably no one out there as rough with their guns especially their AEG or blowback than myself, guys like Poncho can be a witness to how many mechbox that have met their doom in my hands and the countless metal bodies from Zeke, Systema to the old and sturdy CA,
Unfortunately for the paintball bashers out there these RAP4 markers are made to last longer than your average aeg, and when I do play with them it sort of brings back some good old feelings like the time when we are playing with our JAC back in the days.

[Rukus]

You with the C-Scots?

[-Number7-]

Originally Posted by JanusDP

How is "it hurts more" a pro? Honestly, if you're in this game to cause pain you're a sad little person.

Seconded.

Originally Posted by Rukus

Paintball cons

It's paintball

Nuff said =P

[Outcast569]

Paintball

Pros:

Guns are usually lauder
Looks cool when the CO2 “smoke” escapes the barrel <-- Not that big a deal
Hurts more and makes a mark when you are hit <----- being shot in the throat with a bb vs a paint filled ball.... the bb hurts ALOT more like that
(this is a good thing in my mind because it is more like Simmunition)
The bullets are a bigger <---- less chance for the new guy to miss?
More accessible (no import restrictions yet) <--- fair enough yet I prefer a harder to get gun then a really ugly looking one personally. (just an opinion)

[GilesG]

IF airsoft in Canada was more prevalent, I would be playing it more than paintball. It doesnt help that airsoft imports are illegal and there are, what, less than 5 online Candian retailers? I can drive to the nearest paintball store in a few minutes.

That website that was posted "http://www.pozland.com/avp" was biased garbage. The fact is both games have their pros and cons.

-The only big difference between the two in Canada is the cost vs abundance issue. Airsoft is cheaper, but where am I going to go to play it? Paintball is everywhere, Ontario alone has close to 100 established fields, but it is really, really expensive.

-As long as you are playing with good people, it doesnt matter if a gun will leave a paint mark or not, people will call themselves out when hit. Refuse to play with dishonest players. (As a side note though, I find few things more satisfying than a burst of paintballs breaking on your intended target)

-Both have the bad side to the community (and quite frankly, I prefer the little paintballing kids over the idiot that thinks he is ready for WWIII because he commands a team in "airsoft training simulations")

-You want smoke, noise and recoil? Buy a real firearm. Neither paintball or airsoft is realistic, they arent even close.

-The OP's point about paintball being messy is rediculous. They have these things called showers now, he should give them a try. You are going to get dirty or sweaty in any sport.

[rockafella]

Originally Posted by GilesG

(As a side note though, I find few things more satisfying than a burst of paintballs breaking on your intended target)

-Both have the bad side to the community (and quite frankly, I prefer the little paintballing kids over the idiot that thinks he is ready for WWIII because he commands a team in "airsoft training simulations")

-You want smoke, noise and recoil? Buy a real firearm. Neither paintball or airsoft is realistic, they arent even close.

-The OP's point about paintball being messy is rediculous. They have these things called showers now, he should give them a try. You are going to get dirty or sweaty in any sport.

"..few things more satisfying than a burst of paintballs breaking on your intended target" - I'm with ya there man, especially when you're useing red paintballs as we do, it looks like blood. -It's one thing to hit a guy w/ BB's and know you hit him, and another thing to hit someone with a marking round (simunition or paintball) and both KNOW you got him. And the conversations that happen in the safe zone after someone who just got lit up walks in..nuff said.

"...You want smoke, noise and recoil? Buy a real firearm. Neither paintball or airsoft is realistic, they arent even close" True, but most people who play airsoft (at least i speak for myself) play it for the tactical gameplay and simulated 'real' scenarios. Enless you're in the military or LE agancy, you probably will never get to experience true tactical training. There's only so much you can learn from shooting inanimate targets which is why almost all Military and Lawenforcement agencys parctice "force on force training" using simmunition, MILES, or other simmilar tools.

"Airsoft/Paintball - like a video game only the graphics are better."


"The OP's point about paintball being messy is rediculous. They have these things called showers now, he should give them a try. You are going to get dirty or sweaty in any sport." - one thing I find that seems to be too common among many strictly airsoft players (I don't mean to stereo type) is that they spend too much time trying to look pretty and clean. Yes the look is important to me too, you'll never see me wearing any mismatched, or poorly chosen gear, but I'm deffinately not afraid to get a little dirty (the dirtier the better). I mean when you're an actual OP you have more things to worry about than how clean your Tac vest or ACU is. What do you think would happen if a DELTA OP refused to participate in CQB training because he says that the FX (simunition) round will make his uniform dirty? Rediculous right?


( Now just to get everyone back into perspective; I'm not saying eiether sport is better each have their merits/demerits but--- wether it's paintball or airsoft or both, this is a free country, and ultimately this is just a game so lets not get our underwear in a bunch of somthing so trivial, I appriciate all your comments and for shareing your opinions but remember that's all that it is; 'your opinion'. more gaming, less talking)

[rockafella]

ORIGINS:

Airsoft:
reffrence: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classic_airsoft

Despite misconceptions that airsoft originated much later, it was actually first played in the late 1970s, stemming from the concept of realistic-looking guns that shot non-lethal projectiles for sporting and simulation purposes. There were guns of this style before airsoft, such as the Mattel "Shootin' Shell" guns of the late 1950s. The US military even tinkered with ideas of this type after World War II. The BB guns that existed before shot metal BBs that could do a lot of damage to a person and in rare cases, kill them. Mattel's guns were a novelty at best though.

Airsoft filled a void. It originated in Japan, where owning real guns was generally illegal. The first manufacturers were long-standing toy companies such as Masudaya, Fujimi, and Matsushiro. These companies decided it would be a good (and profitable) idea to market BB guns that could be safely shot at others in a similar manner to paintball guns, which were also becoming popular at that time. These guns were spring-powered, single-shot weapons and were often very crude in nature. Many used odd, proprietary ammunition, such as the 7mm "Long Range" ammo some Masudaya guns used, or the soft rubber ammo used in TradeMark's guns. Eventually, it was realized that a standard-size round BB would be cheaper and more efficient to produce. There were a variety of companies making guns during the late 1970s and early 1980s.

The Daisy company had been known for over a century as the premiere producer of BB guns in the US. So in the early 80s, they decided to market airsoft in North America. Up until that time, airsoft was virtually unheard of outside of Japan. Daisy contracted the Maruzen company of Japan to manufacture a line of spring-powered guns to sell in the US. Most of these guns already existed in Japan and were essentially re-packaged for sale in North America. These guns used special BBs loaded into simulated shell casings.

All models were manufactured by Maruzen except the Model 15 H&K MP5K, which was made by Falcon Toy Corp.

These guns were as realistic in appearance as an airsoft or model gun had been up until this point, and many anti-gun and anti-violence organizations showed disfavor towards these items in America.

Airsoft guns: http://www.lonestarairsoft.com/forum...499airsoft.jpg

(Vote Conservative!! or Republican if you're American - to preserve our rights!!)

Paintball
refference:

The first paintballs were created by the Nelson Paint Company in the 1950s for forestry service use in marking trees from a distance, and were also used by cattlemen to mark cows.[2] Two decades later, paintballs were used in a survival game between two friends in the woods of Henniker, New Hampshire, and paintball as a sport was born.

In 1976, Hayes Noel, a stock trader, Bob Gurnsey, and his friend Charles Gaines, a writer[3], were walking home and chatting about Gaines' recent trip to Africa and his experiences hunting buffalo. Eager to recreate the adrenaline rush that came with the thrill of the hunt, and inspired by Richard Connell's The Most Dangerous Game, the two friends came up with the idea to create a game where they could stalk and hunt each other.[4]

In the ensuing months, the friends talked about what sorts of qualities and characteristics made for a good hunter and survivalist. They were stumped, however, on how to devise a test of those skills. It wasn't until a year and a half later that George Butler, a friend of theirs, showed them a paintball gun in an agricultural catalog. The gun was a Nelspot 007 marker manufactured by the Nelson Paint Company.[5]

Twelve players competed against each other with Nelspot 007s pistols in the first paintball game on June 27, 1981. They were: Bob Jones, a novelist and staff writer for Sports Illustrated and an experienced hunter, Ronnie Simpkins, a farmer from Alabama and a master turkey hunter, Jerome Gary, a New York film producer, Carl Sandquist, a New Hampshire contracting estimator, Ritchie White, the New Hampshire forester, Ken Barrett, a New York venturer and hunter, Joe Drinon, a stock-broker and former Golden Gloves boxer from New Hampshire, Bob Carlson, a trauma surgeon and hunter from Alabama, and Lionel Atwill, a writer for Sports Afield, a hunter and a Vietnam vet, Charles Gaines, Bob Gurnsey, and Hayes Noel. The game was capture the flag on an 80 acre wooded cross-country ski area.

Thereafter, the friends devised basic rules for the game fashioned along the lines of capture the flag, and invited friends and a writer from Sports Illustrated to play. They called their game "Survival," and an article about the game was published in the June 1980 issue of Sports Illustrated.[6] As national interest in the game steadily built, Bob Gurnsey formed a company, National Survival Game, and entered a contract with Nelson Paint Company to be the sole distributor of their paintball equipment.[7] Thereafter, they licensed to franchisees in other states the right to sell their guns, paint, and goggles. As a result of their monopoly on equipment, they turned a profit in only six months.[8]

The first games of paintball were very different from modern paintball games. Nelspot pistols were the only gun available. They used 12-gram CO2 cartridges, held at most 10 rounds, and had to be tilted to roll the ball into the chamber and then recocked after each shot. Dedicated paintball masks had not yet been created, so players wore shop glasses that left the rest of their faces exposed. The first paintballs were oil-based and thus not water soluble; "turpentine parties" were common after a day of play.[9] Games often lasted for hours as players stalked each other, and since each player had only a limited number of rounds, shooting was rare.[10]

Between 1981 and 1983, rival manufacturers such as PMI began to create competing products, and it was during those years that the sport took off.[11] Paintball technology gradually developed as manufacturers added a front-mounted pump in order to make recocking easier, then replaced the 12-gram cartridges with larger air tanks, commonly referred to as "constant air".[12] These basic innovations were later followed by gravity feed hoppers and 45-degree elbows to facilitate loading from the hopper.[13]


The new age of paintball guns: http://rap4.com/paintball_news/image...rap5_rap17.jpg

[Rukus]

Originally Posted by rockafella;

"The OP's point about paintball being messy is rediculous. They have these things called showers now, he should give them a try. You are going to get dirty or sweaty in any sport." - one thing I find that seems to be too common among many strictly airsoft players (I don't mean to stereo type) is that they spend too much time trying to look pretty and clean. Yes the look is important to me too, you'll never see me wearing any mismatched, or poorly chosen gear, but I'm deffinately not afraid to get a little dirty (the dirtier the better). I mean when you're an actual OP you have more things to worry about than how clean your Tac vest or ACU is. What do you think would happen if a DELTA OP refused to participate in CQB training because he says that the FX (simunition) round will make his uniform dirty? Rediculous right?

( Now just to get everyone back into perspective; I'm not saying either sport is better each have their merits/demerits but--- wether it's paintball or airsoft or both, this is a free country, and ultimately this is just a game so lets not get our underwear in a bunch of somthing so trivial, I appriciate all your comments and for shareing your opinions but remember that's all that it is; 'your opinion'. more gaming, less talking)

It's not that I hate getting dirty, it's I dislike having to clean paint out of my gear and weapons after a day of playing, because as you well know it takes a long time to clean it properly, especially if you get shot in the rifle or the ball explodes in the rifle, got tired of that after a while. I get just as dirty playing airsoft as I do on a field ex with the army. And I still see some of our guys running around with simunition marks on their tact vests when I'm at work lol. But I wouldn't mind having an experience with the Rap4 stuff just for shits'n giggles though. I'm fairly open minded and you right in the end it's an oppinion and just a game. For me it comes down to cost and personal preference nothing more nothing less.

[wildcard]

cleaning paint by far beat out cleaning bb's from your hair or scalp because of some noob got trigger happy or got a nervous reaction when mercied. Like I said all these bitching about who is better is pointless we are all playing the same game so SHUT UP!, Enjoy and GAME ON!!!

[rockafella]

A video of the next geeration of paintball gameing:

Rap4 airsoft/paintball video

YouTube - NZTGA Whiskey Team CQB RAP4 RAM ACTION

YouTube - RAP4 Mil-Sim paintball marker

[Goodl2ussian]

^^^ what is it? its not airsoft...its not paintball either

edit: nvm i watched the 2nd vid now forget i said nething lol

[Skladfin]

This forum is so biased... but didn't expect any better =)

[yanhchan]

Is there a conversion to not use the airfin BBs and just use normal BBs without the ejecting shells?

[HGI]

Originally Posted by rockafella

"
"The OP's point about paintball being messy is rediculous. They have these things called showers now, he should give them a try. You are going to get dirty or sweaty in any sport." - one thing I find that seems to be too common among many strictly airsoft players (I don't mean to stereo type) is that they spend too much time trying to look pretty and clean. Yes the look is important to me too, you'll never see me wearing any mismatched, or poorly chosen gear, but I'm deffinately not afraid to get a little dirty (the dirtier the better). I mean when you're an actual OP you have more things to worry about than how clean your Tac vest or ACU is. What do you think would happen if a DELTA OP refused to participate in CQB training because he says that the FX (simunition) round will make his uniform dirty? Rediculous right?

I'm guessing you take all your rap4 guns in the shower with you after a nice long day getting shot by paintballs and getting paint all over inside and out of your gun.

[Skladfin]

You get dirty just playing around. The amount of paint you get is quite minor considering how much dirt you get on yourself when you prone down.

If you are scared of getting dirty, you shouldn't be playing these kind of games anyways, stop whining, jesus, be a man.

I'm pretty damn sure you guys have shower and laundry at your house, so stop making "Getting dirty" as an excuse to hate paintball.