TM 5.1 Hicapa Broken

[cbcsteve]

Please only Hi-capa experience users answer

Basic Info
2nd Owner - TM Hicapa Purchased from Kamatokai
2nd Owner - Metal Slide Springfield Armoury Purchased from Tomolok


How my problem happened
1. Got a Metal slide from Tomolok, but the Blowback unit didn't seem to fit flush so I cannot put the metal slide in without it getting stuck right away, but the slide fits without the internals

2. So the metal slide does not fit in with all the internals in so I transfer the Tm internals back into stock plastic slide

3. When firing the Loading muzzle keeps getting stuck, shoots one BB but does not retract properly, the spring is slightly bent

4. The loading muzzle when I pull it to test once in awhile it goes back slowly as if there is a lot of sticky material

5. Need new muzzle and blowback unit?

Quick Summary
- Gun was working before trying to transfer internals into metal slide
- The metal slide is Springfield that was once fitted on a 1911, was told that the slide would fit on a hi-capa but it does not
- Mags are fine no problem
- Loading muzzle keeps getting stuck forward and must be pushed by hand to get it back into starting position

[Shirley]

Well first it's not broken. lol!

Also, what kind of slide is it made by?

[cbcsteve]

Well it is if its not shooting as it should especially when all internals were put back into stock form then something is broken

Springfield Armoury Slide purchased from Tomolok he says it may need a TK slide spacer, main problem is once all internals are put in I cannot even rack the slide onto the handle. About 2 inches when pushing it in it stops.

Main Problem

Loading Muzzle Does not Re-seat back into its position it just sticks out forward.

Could it be weak spring?

[ILLusion]

TK slide spacer is NOT required! It's only required if you are installing a Hi-Capa slide in to a Marui 1911... which it doesn't sound like you are.
Even if you tried installing the spacer, you couldn't. The space where it's suppose to be installed doesn't exist on a Hi-Capa. It's for 1911 only!

Many aftermarket slides (notably PGC and Shooters Design) are manufactured to tighter tolerances than stock Marui. Mix that in with some loosely toleranced die-casted blow back units and die-casted rear sights and you'll start to run in to problems. I've had my fair share of modding to get blowback units to fit.

First thing to do is to try installing the blowback unit without the rear sight installed. This is almost always the problem. If you experience a clean and flush mount without the rear sight installed, then you've localized your problem and it almost always has to do with that circular "nub" on the bottom of the sight base. Easiest solution is to just grind the entire thing off, although with more care, you can localize the issue further.

Regarding the loading nozzle, are you able to slide it back and forth (no spring installed) with ease?

[cbcsteve]

Stock TM Slide
Okay without the spring I can still Slide it back and forth with ease. But after shooting with TM mags things seem okay, but when shooting with WE mags may have screwed it up? I noticed the loading muzzle is hard to push in even by hand. As if the Rubber must have gotten really stiff in the Blow back unit.

Or it can be just a isolated variable in which I did not let the mag cool and it was cold and white mist was coming out (Coming out of from my trunk after game)

Though fact of the matter is the loading muzzle seem to be the main problem of the game in my whole night

Metal Slide with Rear Sight Removed - No black spring too
Hurray it fits but now I have really hard time racking slide back and forth sometimes it just sticks all the way back when I racked it and have to use force to push it back

What I noticed is that at the back. The back of the slide is not completely aligned with the back. So I cannot put up the safety as the slide is too far back by like maybe a 1 cm

[ILLusion]

The o-ring shouldn't freeze up like that. Even if it did, it would contract and move out of the way. If it's the old o-ring style, make sure it's still seated in its channel. If it's the newer cup style, make sure none of the lip edges are torn.

When you moving the slide with no rear sight installed, do you also have the recoil spring guide installed? Check to make sure the corner of the leg of the blow back unit is not getting caught behind the disconnect lever. This tends to happen with no recoil spring guide installed.

... 1cm back is waaaaaaaay too far back and anything but normal. Something is catching it to cause it to sit that far back.

[cbcsteve]

Quick Update
Recoil spring is installed as well, perhaps not 1cm off sorry I may have guestimated it wrong but its just a tinge a bit off like couple mm

But I got it to shoot again in the Plastic TM Slide but as I shoot I look down and the blowback does not seem as fast, I can see the loading muzzle kind of slide its way back ever so slightly as if there some goo.

Going to wipe it clean and see what happens, could it be from the small clear tape I put on the spring to hold it in place when trying to put it in the metal slide? I took it off and it still slithers back to its seating

[cbcsteve]

Cup Seal
Appears to have no torns, I unsure if its the newer or older but on mine it has a large circular rubber around the tip, so its not like the one you have in your Retailer first post

Firing Plastic TM Slide

Gun shoots but after a couple shots its as if the Rubber tip of the Blowback cup seal seems to get really stiff and causes the slide to rack back and slowly go back forward and sometimes I have to push the slide forward again to shoot again

[m102404]

Illusion is the Hicapa king...but I'll toss in a couple of guesses so long as nobody minds.

1. Sticking nozzle.
- does it always work with TM mags and not WE mags. Take a close look at the rubber seal where the gas would vent up into the nozzle. If it's riding high, it'll push excessively on the loading nozzle and may be causing it to hang up. I've got the reverse problem with a build at the moment where the grip is riding too low.

2. Tight racking.
If the slide (you've got the stock plastic one on now right?) is tight when you're racking it back, then the rails of the blow back unit is rubbing the frame. On the left side, the "leg" of the blow back unit can sometimes catch on the nub that trips and disconnects the valve knocker. I've lightly sanded/polished those two surfaces at times to get a nice smooth operation. Again, most times it's because the blow back unit isn't sitting up high enough in the slide.

3. Not racking back forward.
- are you using the stock TM plastic outer barrel with the stock plastic slide?
- if when it gets stuck, will it go forward if you 1) drop/eject the mag? 2) gently push on the muzzle of the outer barrel?

Best of luck with it,

Tys

[cbcsteve]

Quick Update!

Using Stock TM Slide
- Not TM Stock Outer Barrel, Kamatokai put in a Metal Outer Barrel
- Metal Outer Barrel appear it has a lot of scratch marks, perhaps from the slide racking back and forth
- TTAC3 Nov 28 Gun was working fine on both WE and TM mags, but noticed the loading muzzle was sticking a little bit
- Even on TM mags I noticed the loading muzzle still sticking forward as if it were attached to the Hop-up Unit, at that point I would have to use my finger to pull the loading muzzle back into the blowback unit (Spring is in)

Metal Slide
Yes it must be catching the nub as I have to push it back forward with force which probably must be the nub blocking it.

Problem Variables?

Not Racking Back Forward
- With mag in or out that loading muzzle is stick right out
-- Mag in I can still push the loading muzzle back into place
-- Mag out same thing as if mag was in

Isolated Variables
- Probably not the Metal Outer Barrel since I can rack the slide back and forth back and forth very smoothly until the loading muzzle gets stuck forward and I see the loading muzzle then slither back into its seating

Possible Solutions
1. Get new recoil springs?
Perhaps the recoil spring in the blowback unit is not strong enough to pull the loading muzzle back into its seating position

2. Get new blowback unit?
Perhaps the rubber tip on the cup seal has somehow gotten all soggy causing it the loading too much friction when it re-seats

3. Get Blowback unit and recoil springs?
- Just for the hell of it

4. Get parts sanded down for Metal Slide to fit in properly
Or I just sell it back out, TM slide is working fine

[m102404]

Steve,

I get what you're saying and it's a bugger...

To my understanding...
The feeding nozzle spring is cosmetic...it just causes the nozzle to snap back out of the way so that it doesn't appear in the ejection port. When racked back, the stop on the nozzle should reach the end of it's travel in the slot of the blow back housing and cause it to be pulled back with the rest of the slide.

Somewhere in the blow back cycle there is (one or both):
1. Too much friction, causing drag and killing off the recoil forces of the expanding gas.
2. No enough gas expanding between the piston and the loading nozzle

It doesn't take much to put it out of whack. My last hicapa was doing the same thing...and it still sort of does. I reverted back to a stock floating valve and spring and it's a bit better, but not perfect. I'm trying a new outer barrel tomorrow...and I'll see how that goes.

I'd go through fully disassembling the top again, closely inspecting each piece, applying a little lube here and there and reassembling again. Don't over tighten any of the screws. I'd also pull apart the outer/inner barrel/hopup chamber and reseat everything there.

[cbcsteve]

Ah yes thanks Tys and Brian but I think you got it Tys

"The feeding nozzle spring is cosmetic...it just causes the nozzle to snap back out of the way so that it doesn't appear in the ejection port."

Thats what it is doing when I shoot, the loading nozzle (sorry if I called it loading muzzle) just sticks out forward which causes the blowback to be slowed, at times if I shoot on empty and it racks backwards to its empty position I see the loading nozzle sluggishly move back

[m102404]

Again...Illusion probably has a lot more insight on this one...but the cause for it on my current project was probably an overly large piston o-ring (upgrade part).

I put in a tighter o-ring (so that the "dry" fit was actually pretty loose) and it seemed to work better.

Tys

[ILLusion]

There's another explanation to the problem, but I didn't mention it earlier as it's rare:

Over time, improperly matched metal barrels to slides will cause damage to the upper rear portions of the ejection port of the slide. It's caused by the slide bashing against the top of the chamber as the slide cycles forward. I've seen in rare instances where the slide has bashed the chamber to the point where a "lip" forms from material being pushed backward and riding down in to the path of the loading nozzle. The result is the loading nozzle raking against this lip and a point of friction is created. This can be easily recognized by heavy scratching on the top of the loading nozzle.

[cbcsteve]

Yay! Woah you got it right I believe! You should have - Hi-Capa God Certified - Brian

I think it is the Loading nozzle rubbing against the rubber O ring creating a lot of friction. And yes the Loading Nozzle tips also appears to have some scratch marks. So yes it must be the Mismatched Outer Barrel and to TM Plastic Slide.

Too bad I did not get the Plastic outer barrel slide with it (2nd Owner from Kamatokai)

So I guess I need a new Blowback unit and revert back to stock outer barrel slide?