loadmaster (multiple magazine dispencer)

[sharpshiell]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n0xQLVwnSzg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6Eb_kxZ5a0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gtSpNYx-Hg

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bozDHEftzy4

Hi guys just looking for some initial feed back. This is my invention that I have been working on for a year now and is not for sale or anything like that. I have already had many many,,,many discussions with fiends, coworkers(military) and ex Canadian SF's. I am looking for feed back on things that I might have overlooked. Before any says the usual thing of they have seen it before please keep in mind that I do have the patent so no this is a new idea.

My patented concept is a system of operation where firearm magazines are ejected from a container sequentially to the operator (think candy Pez dispenser). Empty mags are placed back into the container. I say system of operation because where it is worn, capacity, shape etc are irrelevant. I have built working prototypes of back packs, hips and chest versions.

There are many advantages to using this system instead of regular mag pouches. Muscle memory speeds up reload time. Recycling empty mags back into the container reuses space rather then using the dump pouch currently used. When used as a back pack it frees the users chest of bulky mags. When fully sealed it protects the ammunition in the mags from FOD rather than using impact/dust covers. When worn as a backpack and made using ballistic material it is the worlds first fully integrated load carriage and body armor. One of its best uses would be as a stationary resupply point for the shooters ie a base front gate, police cruiser door, helicopter for example.

Above are amateur videos of early concepts but the idea the same. These videos show a exaggerated variant that carries up to 25 stanag or P-MAG magazines simply to show that it can be done not that it should be done as that was very heavy in ammunition. The more useful variants would be any size the operator wants i.e. 6, 8,12 mags using a modular design including the option of a much lower profile version where the mags are in series not parallel making the carrier thinner.

[sharpshiell]

I have a couple of counter points and the a summary at the end.

1. you did not address the idea of a relatively stationary model not worn by the operator at all. IE front gate of a base so when you are doing gate guard there is more mags ready and you don't have to carry all that weight. I would have loved this in Bosnia doing gate guard to give me extra security.

2. The "backpack" is serenely not intended for front line infantry (remember I was too). That configuration is more law enforcement and assault/counter assault, para rescue,boat boarding etc. By removing bulky loads from the front of chest it allows better hand to hand and flex ability for example. I can state several occupations that the operators are already carrying mags on or close to there back. Not dismounted inf

3. Your point that "IMO it looks bulky, using regular mag pouches would take up less space". Keep in mind that that what you saw was a working prototype only. It has no flex or curvature yet. My math about bulk is simple. A mag stacked directly next another and another uses less space then the same number of mags put out with spaces in between them in any orientation.

4. Even my crappy home made versions have not broken. ever. never jammed. ever. There is nothing in there to break. to simple. Hollow box with incline plane. Using the right materials i want to drive over it with a LAV.

5. "If someone were to use one that could fit 8, 12, etc mags that would be a lot of weight all on one side, plus the weight of the system." The weight of a single mag pouch is approx 3.5 ounces. The weight of a double mag pouch is approx 4.2. triple. 4.8 ounces. If we where to plot these on a graph the slope of the line would decrease from single to triple mag. This is because there is less material, locking mechs IE buckles Velcro, mounting straps.

6. The system you saw for AR15 mags is aligned in a parallel setup. Placing the mags in a series orientation significantly reduces the profile to that of the mags it carries.

7. "This can be done with anything, not like you can't put loading from a regular mag pouch into muscle memory" The problem with this argument is that you violated the very def of muscle memory. Taking multiple mags from different locations is not "memory through repetition" My idea is a fast mag pouch located in the shooters "sweet spot" that continually refills it self.

8. No empty mags do not get mixed in with empty. It simply reuses space. as you are removing full mags to shoot you are creating empty space for used mags.

9. "What happens if your backpack system breaks off?" I love what if questions. What if the strike face plate falls out or cracks? I get it. This concept would not work for all trades. For others it might.

In short for a dismounted infantry solider the system would have to be
-lighter then all other options
-modular so the solider can deiced how many mags to carry
-flexible to conform to the body
-reliable keep the operation simple "KISS"
-environmentally protected keep out dirt, sand etc till the mags are needed
-not a backpack
-use PALS attachments to work with of the shelf equipment

[BennyBoy]

Maybe making the mags come out at an slant would reduce the profile? Interesting idea however

[Hectic]

Yeah i thnk its a cool concept.
The fact its for p90 mags makes it a bit bulky,
but say it was for m4 mags. It could be about the size of a tripple double mag pouch (one that holds six double stacked)
but it could hold 8 or 10 mags in the same space (sort of) it would stick out a bit further but could be a bit narrower so you (well at least i with my small frame) could wear two on the front of my rig one situated with the opening in the front center and one on the off hand side (left for me)
facing downwards (sort of over the hip) then i could use that one if i was prone blocking the front center one or upright once the front center one was empty.
I think it could use some kind of stopper between the last mag and the first empty one so once all the mags inside are empty if you try n grab one there is nothing to grab.
Also it would have to be somewhat flexable as on my small frame to wear two id have to have it curved (i got a 30ish waist so you have an idea what i mean)
For sure for urban/cqb this thing would be awesome as most wouldnt need snything more then baisic gear a gun and as much ammo as they could carry. For out in the field when a patroll pac is needed they would have to me more the size and shape of existing pouches just with a lil more capacity in a simaler space and the ability to be mounted in a simaler fashion.

[pugs144]

Yo dawg, I heard you like magazines, so I put a magazine in a magazine so you can mag change while you mag change.

But seriously, someone else tried came out with a similar concept around 2004-2006. If you still want to pursue this I think ASC is the wrong forum to solict feedback; the audience at Army.ca will provide you more robust suggestions and criticisms but you'll need a thick skin.

[sharpshiell]

@ pugs144

To which product in 2004 are you referring? Starac tec fast mag? This is an entirely different concept and the spirit of the invention in completely diferent. You cannot compare mine to that as they have an . What do they do with the empty mags? Three mag capacity? One shape? There where problems with this idea. Remember If it was the same thing I would not have gotten the patent.

@ -Skeletor-

Did you just compare this invention to the same idea as an empty ammo can? Speed, security, protection, organization of full to empty. By this logic why use a water canteen when a bucket works just fine? Ammo cans where ment to carry cliped ammo not loaded mags.

My commits about the plates where just to show anything can happen in the field. But you made my point for me "Would have to be a serious issue with the plate carrier for the plate to fall out." If its a serious enough situation for the dispenser to fall off then it a serious situation.

Most of the System that you are seeing is wasted space. For now I am using CF springs and unmolded ABS plastic sheets to manufacture the body's. This is just cost effective for prototyping. If bulk is the biggest problem for you the rotate the mags 90 deg so they are in series. Curve the container. Make it into individual pieces that fit together like Lego and ware in on your stomach. Easy but hard to design and make in my garage.

As for the ballistic idea that was just an idea not the main theme. Like I said front line infantry would NOT use it as a back pack and there for it would be point less to armor it for them. Please keep in mind that there are many nations and professions that use firearms that go into dangerous situations.

"I've reloaded from different mag pouches without issue just fine." I want to go from just fine to super bad ass. I want to get rid of the dump pouch and keep reload speed to the same standard or better. Going from pouch to pouch takes your mind of your surroundings and causes you to focus on where your next mag is going to come from and what do do with the empty one if your not just dropping it on the ground. As you can see in the PMAG video reloading is sub 3 sec each time (of course no bolt catch is used)

It might help to think of these you see in the video as testbeds. Trust me the final product will not look like these do. The only thing these prototypes are designed to do is dispense mags and make room for empty's.

[sharpshiell]

just because that is what is currently done does not mean it should stay that way

You keep saying this like "works well" or " just fine". Don't you want to do better? To improve? I would like to see a test between two soldiers. one using your ammo can and another using a custom built dedicated system and see who fights and shoots better.

Nah no straps. Pals attachments built into the system for attachment to a load bearing system on the operators chest,hip,stomach or back

I can still handle a c-7. But again I look forward to seeing a full test between old and new.

"Ok, if in the future this is your plan, great. But, right now all your have is your prototypes and that is what I am commenting on." The only point of these demos is the system of operation. Molds are being made for basic testing in ont.

[sharpshiell]

What would be advantageous in a stationary location like a base front gate or vehicle would be a system that easily dispenses extra mags. Kinda like a buddy handing you your next mag. This means that the operator is reloading from that location not there loadout. When the time comes to dismount or bug out the operators loadout has not been depleted of ready mags just the stationary dispenser. there for fight harder.


ACK????

Yes old school vs new dog....just kidding

most company's that have liked the idea like Fellfab or CPgear are textile not mold making. I was also delayed because of laws in the CF. Public servant invention act, then conflict of interest, then blah. to say the least that's all done now.