Battary Charger Help - TLP 4000C & Smart Charger (NPT Charger)

[Cottoni]

By the way Kos-mos,
Does the Duratrax Intellipeak ICE come with all the large a mini tamiya connector necessary to charge Airsoft guns battery, or do i have to buy the connectors separately?

Is it easy and simple to use it?

[Kos-Mos]

If you don't understand the specs, don't get it.

If you go to Duratrax website, you can see all their Intellipeak series charger...

look at the digital pulse...
http://www.duratrax.com/caraccys/dtxp4100.html

remind you anything?

The ICE is way better, but again if you don't understand the specs given, you are not ready for a charger like that.
You better get the Piranha Digital...
Only reason I changed is that my new racing packs needed to be charged at least 6A.... the piranha only does up tp 5A

As for the TLP-15 (same exact thing as the Intellipeak Digital pulse) I found that it tend not to stop charging the batteries (got 2 battery explode on me, and they where not old at all)

If you want you can also check for CheckPoint brand chargers. They are apparently a division of Duratrax and do the ICE, but with some revisions. (Backlit LCD, better software, can discharge at 30A)

http://www.bestrc.com/teamcheckpoint/chargers/

*edit*
All chargers come with large Tamiya style plug
The ICE also comes with alligator clips and have banana plugs on the other end so you can change the leads without having to cut wires.
So do the Team CheckPoint one.
The Piranha one had some quick attach inputs so you can also change the leads, but the lead wires tend to break after a few months, then you just have to cut, skin and twist the conductor for a few other months.

*edit2*
For the mini style plugs, you have 2 choices
1- order some extra plugs online
2- change all your plugs to Dean's Ultra and take the one inside your gun to make an adapter in case you need to borrow a pack

[Scarecrow]

Originally Posted by Kos-Mos

To Scarecrow...

Just curious...
How does your charger decide if the pack connected is made from mini (2/3A) or from sub-C cells... best guess would be internal res... but still I have racing grade 2/3A packs that have lower res than most sub-C packs

I honestly can't tell you Kos-Mos. What I do know is there is a general chipset for charging out there that most "Smart" (meaning NPT/Delta-v/# cell detectors) chargers use - not just mine, that have circuitry to sense and logic to calculate such things. What I have found from experience, owning several different chargers from manufacturers making many claims is that the best all around charger which requires no technical knowledge to use is the NPT Smart Charger which I sourced and currently sell. One of the reasons I started selling it was because most of my teammates were going through batteries like wildfire, including myself, not understanding battery technology at all, and we all commonly burned our batteries - most of us had the money to buy really Gucci chargers (I paid $300 for my fuzzy logic one back in an RC hobby shop in Scarborough) and it made no difference. I finally came across one of these ones and was blown away at the simplicity and speed of charge and the lack of heat generated during the charge process - and the extended life of my batteries. So it was first by experience as a player that I came across this charger. Then all my teammates wanted one. Then players who saw them wanted one. Pretty soon I had sold over 100 of them. Now its one of the more common chargers out there.

NPT Explained: http://www.bbbastard.com/nptdetails.htm

TankDude: That paper is an interesting find, but, I find it hard to believe based on both my experience and also by the number of high end electronics manufacturers that use NPT, (including the US military) to condition mission critical and lifesaving batteries - funny enough even the AED and Defib battery circuitry on our fire rescue vehicles in town has battery conditioning using, in part, NPT technology - and thats NFPA standards which are lifesaving standards. So that paper contradicts a lot of what the higher end of the industry is doing. My feeling is that there is a vested interest at play there.

As for proof, I do know a little chemistry and when it comes to oxidation and the claims regarding using a negative pulse to degassify a battery are supported by the physics of the process. Also, from an evidence point of view, I can set both my NPT charger and my TLP chargers side by side and fast charge time is similar for both for the same battery, but I do find the TLP charger charges the batteries at a hotter (much hotter) temperature, and that is a bad thing.

Kos-Mos, I also contend that these TLP hand adjustable chargers are by and large a product for the RC car racing scene, where peaking your battery before that critical race can make all the difference to winning and racers look at batteries in a little more disposable mentality in RC car racing than they do in airsoft - ultimately a battery is a chemical construct that will degrade over time and use. How you treat it will dictate the length of life. Unlike airsoft, RC car racing is a sustained use of the battery whereas airsoft is a very short stop and go, relying more on a battery's short surge performance than its sustained run time. As such in airsoft its possible to stretch a battery's life longer because you're not heating the crap out of it during sustained discharge. Finally, battery life is measured in charge/discharge cycles. Unless you're dealing with memory or performance issues, cycling your battery uses up its life and should be minimized where possible. I talk to some people who don't realize this and computer cycle their batteries after every game and wonder why they only get half a season out of their batteries. I've got some batteries that are over 3 years old and still working great - a testimony I think to those NPT chargers.

NPT is not something I developed, but its something I've championed with my product line for over 3 years now because I was so impressed with the results as a player who played often twice to three times a week (when I was hosting at Deadlands I held Tuesday, Thursday and weekend games each week during the summer), so I am talking from experience as well as having done research on the subject. Also when I started selling NPT chargers, I was one of the only ones who made the distinction and promoted them over straight peak chargers - now many other airsoft retailers have picked it up including those on the internet.

[Scarecrow]

P.S. I am not bashing the TLP chargers - what I am saying is if you're going to spend the money, get one with NPT capability, and learn about battery charging so you don't mess up the settings when you charge your batteries. Also, don't use the cycle mode unless you're addressing a specific problem, it puts undo wear on the battery. If you're prepared to do those things then you should have a good experience with TLP and fuzzy logic on the higher end chargers. My contention is that most players don't want to be battery chemistry experts calculating their own amps when charging batteries for the next game, so the simple solution, that is inexpensive one, has value over the complex one that is more expensive when you compare apples to apples.

[m102404]

I've used one of BBbastard's NPT charger on all my batteries for the past season (since Feb2007). No worries about burning down the house overnight, charges/tops-off really quickly, simple red=charging/green=done (I've got other things to do than to sit around watching batteries charge), comes with all the connectors for just about every type of connector (except Deans Ultra...hint hint). There's only one switch on the thing, to charge between 1A and 2A.

I have no idea if it prolongs the life of the battery, removes memory, revives a dead battery, makes your gun shoot for ever all day, whatever/etc....I'll just leave that to the battery/electricians out there to debate. It just works (as long as you plug it into the wall for power!!! ).

The ONLY time it didn't pickup and autodetect a battery, was when I was helping out a new guy and his battery was so dead that neither his smart charger, nor mine would detect it. I plugged it into a $7 wall charger for 15min and then the NPT charger would pick it up. It took a long time before that one was done, but the new guy has been rocking on his M4 ever since.

PLUS...it's f*cking silent...no fans, or droning noise, no beeping or buzzing...

PLUS...the times that I've dealt with Scarecrow, he's been extremely good and fast at replying to questions or followup info. Shipping times were great. His prices are extremely competitive for what you're getting and he'll stand behind what he sells.

And yes...I've run out of 0.20 bbs and am hoping he'll toss me some gratis for this unsolicited, shameless plug...just kidding, LOL.

Tys

[Jimski]

question : I always use the low-speed charge settings on my tl-15, but was wondering: what changes exactly when fast-charging? is it the voltage ? is the dial setting used when doing so ?

[leblanc74]

Originally Posted by Jimski

question : I always use the low-speed charge settings on my tl-15, but was wondering: what changes exactly when fast-charging? is it the voltage ? is the dial setting used when doing so ?

I also leave it at the minimium setting, that is the rate that charges the battery, to my understanding, if you take your time on recharging the battery, better life you'll have with them...

that dial is for mAh capacity rating of the battery... the manual states that if a 2400 mAh battery is plugged in, then you set the dial just below to the 2400 mark...yes I know there are no marks but you have to approximate it...I advise you to set it lower than the batteries' mAh to be sure not to burn them...

[Cottoni]

Originally Posted by Kos-Mos

If you don't understand the specs, don't get it.

If you go to Duratrax website, you can see all their Intellipeak series charger...

look at the digital pulse...
http://www.duratrax.com/caraccys/dtxp4100.html

remind you anything?

The ICE is way better, but again if you don't understand the specs given, you are not ready for a charger like that.
You better get the Piranha Digital...
Only reason I changed is that my new racing packs needed to be charged at least 6A.... the piranha only does up tp 5A

As for the TLP-15 (same exact thing as the Intellipeak Digital pulse) I found that it tend not to stop charging the batteries (got 2 battery explode on me, and they where not old at all)

If you want you can also check for CheckPoint brand chargers. They are apparently a division of Duratrax and do the ICE, but with some revisions. (Backlit LCD, better software, can discharge at 30A)

http://www.bestrc.com/teamcheckpoint/chargers/

*edit*
All chargers come with large Tamiya style plug
The ICE also comes with alligator clips and have banana plugs on the other end so you can change the leads without having to cut wires.
So do the Team CheckPoint one.
The Piranha one had some quick attach inputs so you can also change the leads, but the lead wires tend to break after a few months, then you just have to cut, skin and twist the conductor for a few other months.

*edit2*
For the mini style plugs, you have 2 choices
1- order some extra plugs online
2- change all your plugs to Dean's Ultra and take the one inside your gun to make an adapter in case you need to borrow a pack

I've never had a AEG gun before or used any of these chargers, so i have no experience at all with it.

Would it be possible to learn how to operate the ICE charger by reading the instructions that comes with it?

For now i will not try to use any of the more advanced feature of the charger. For now i just want to plug my battery and charge it without destroying the battery or shortening the battery's life.

Would even in that case be hard to operate the ICE charger?

Of course down the road i will read more and learn more about the features so that i can safely use them, otherwise why would i buy it.

What I DON'T want to do is to spend about $65 to $75 bucks for a Piranha or any smart chargers now and then later, after seeing that the ICE and more advanced ones are way batter with all its great features, have to spend again another $130 bucks more, whereas I could just drop another $50 extra bucks and get the ICE one.

So my main concern now is to know how hard it is to use/operate the ICE or TLP 15 one, because it will be pointless to buy the ICE and then, not being able to charge my batteries, have to get a another cheap charger

Thanks

PS: sorry guys for SO MANY noob questions, but after dropping over a $1000 on my first Airsoft AEGs, my mind is going nuts, and i can't think on anything else
This thing is sure addictive, and expensive, and you guys have been so helpful all along that questions just keep pooping up on my mind

[leblanc74]

Originally Posted by Cottoni

I've never had a AEG gun before or used any of these chargers, so i have no experience at all with it.

Would it be possible to learn how to operate the ICE charger by reading the instructions that comes with it?

For now i will not try to use any of the more advanced feature of the charger. For now i just want to plug my battery and charge it without destroying the battery or shortening the battery's life.

Would even in that case be hard to operate the ICE charger?

Of course down the road i will read more and learn more about the features so that i can safely use them, otherwise why would i buy it.

What I DON'T want to do is to spend about $65 to $75 bucks for a Piranha or any smart chargers now and then later, after seeing that the ICE and more advanced ones are way batter with all its great features, have to spend again another $130 bucks more, whereas I could just drop another $50 extra bucks and get the ICE one.

So my main concern now is to know how hard it is to use/operate the ICE or TLP 15 one, because it will be pointless to buy the ICE and then, not being able to charge my batteries, have to get a another cheap charger

Thanks

PS: sorry guys for SO MANY noob questions, but after dropping over a $1000 on my first Airsoft AEGs, my mind is going nuts, and i can't think on anything else
This thing is sure addictive, and expensive, and you guys have been so helpful all along that questions just keep pooping up on my mind

welcome to aircrack.... hello my name is leblanc and I am an addict to airsoft...

wait until you get into some gears.... LOL :smack:

[Cottoni]

BTW, have you guys noticed when we search on google.ca for NPT charger this thread is the first one in the list. Even on top of bbbastard.com website.
Even when you type TLP 4000C, or piranha digital peak charger it show up as one of the top ones on the search list.
Cool isn't it?

Maybe not? since there is also lots of other thread from Airsoft Canada :smack:

[Scarecrow]

Google is pretty cool in that regard. I am not sure how they index so much stuff so quickly. Even Santa could take a lesson on speed from Google...

[Cottoni]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Google is pretty cool in that regard. I am not sure how they index so much stuff so quickly. Even Santa could take a lesson on speed from Google...

I just found out something I didn't noticed and nobody mentioned about the Intellipeak ICE charger, which is the fact that the Ice is a DC charger ONLY and if you want to use it on AC power, such as a household outlet, you'll need to use an AC-to-DC power supply!

I will basically only use the charger in a household outlet, at least for now.

Guys I am the "noobiest" guy around here, I am pretty sure of it! the only batteries i know how to charge are my laptop, cell phone and PSP batteries :smack: :banghead:

When I go to the hobby shop and ask for the Intellipeak ICE, how should I order the AC-to-DC power supply?
Should i just ask for a AC power cord for the charger?

Does any of you know a link to where i can see such AC-to-DC power supply for the ICE charger? i just want to see how they look like and what is the proper name.

I don't believe the guys at the hoppy shop really know what they are doing, at least if they are as knowledgeable as the futureshop and best buy people (please no offense for the good ones or if you work there

But i trust you guys

[leblanc74]

Originally Posted by Cottoni

I just found out something I didn't noticed and nobody mentioned about the Intellipeak ICE charger, which is the fact that the Ice is a DC charger ONLY and if you want to use it on AC power, such as a household outlet, you'll need to use an AC-to-DC power supply!

I will basically only use the charger in a household outlet, at least for now.

Guys I am the "noobiest" guy around here, I am pretty sure of it! the only batteries i know how to charge are my laptop, cell phone and PSP batteries :smack: :banghead:

When I go to the hobby shop and ask for the Intellipeak ICE, how should I order the AC-to-DC power supply?
Should i just ask for a AC power cord for the charger?

Does any of you know a link to where i can see such AC-to-DC power supply for the ICE charger? i just want to see how they look like and what is the proper name.

I don't believe the guys at the hoppy shop really know what they are doing, at least if they are as knowledgeable as the futureshop and best buy people (please no offense for the good ones or if you work there

But i trust you guys

My TL15 also came with a European outlet "big hunkers", as long the charger can regulate itself it is ok....the TL15 had a switch at the back to set to 120 volt...i simply use a computer outlet cord, I do not know about the ICE product, maybe here that has one can relate to it

....those ac/dc are quite expensive, try to avoid extra cost if possible, and stick with somthing simple...

[Cottoni]

Originally Posted by Scarecrow

Google is pretty cool in that regard. I am not sure how they index so much stuff so quickly. Even Santa could take a lesson on speed from Google...

Scarecrow you are dead right!
I asked some of these cheap ebay smart charger and NONE have the NPT technology.
So I guess they just use the same housing

[Cottoni]

Originally Posted by leblanc74

My TL15 also came with a European outlet "big hunkers", as long the charger can regulate itself it is ok....the TL15 had a switch at the back to set to 120 volt...i simply use a computer outlet cord, I do not know about the ICE product, maybe here that has one can relate to it

....those ac/dc are quite expensive, try to avoid extra cost if possible, and stick with somthing simple...

yeah, man a freaking good ac/dc will cost me more 140 bucks, so i out of the ICE, because for that price i'd rather get the awesome systema one (does the sytema have ac/dc adapter??)

leblanc7, did your TLP - TL15 come standard with the AC/DC power cable adapter?
Does the TLP - TL15 come with all the necessary cables for large and mini connector for airsoft batteries?

Can the TLP - TL15 charge a large type 3600 mha battery? i thought it could charge, but reading rewolf website it says that the TLP - TL15 would batteries ranging from 110mah through 3300mah.
So how about the 3600 mha battery? because i have one 3600 mha here.
http://www.redwolfairsoft.com/redwol...l?prodID=10869


I read the instructions that come with any TLP charge are bad and pretty much useless, so i wonder how hard will it be for me to actually learn how to use the TLP-TL15 charger