See through guns and the death of "airsoft"

[Mudder]

Originally Posted by Daiviet

You know, you should watch what you say about SOMEONE YOU HAVE NEVER MET IN PERSON. Brian is not someone to care about something as trivial as that.

Quaking in my boots, junior!
Note I said, They and They're, get with the syntax.

:lol:

[Drake]

Okay guys, post like adults or I'll dish out infractions with a big ass smile on face.

[Mudder]

Originally Posted by Drake

Okay guys, post like adults or I'll dish out infractions with a big ass smile on face.

OK, you got a point.

[Drake]

Originally Posted by mcguyver

Drake saw this coming, almost exactly 1 year ago. He gets first dibs on "I told you so":

I'd actually forgotten about that post. I recall it took a lot of flack back then from all the Expansionists.

Nothing new to say really, nothing has changed. Some of you have now come to certain realizations about clearsoft and the push to grow the sport; you shouldn't flatter yourselves into thinking you're among the first to realize it: the schism happened a long time ago, the vets are already doing their thing on their end, milsim will live on -- just not in the public eye.

"Airsoft" as a public word has become synonymous with clearsoft and backyard skirmishes. This is what it's become and to all the oldschool airsofters, it's now in the same bin as speedball. Heck, there are paintballers out there who at least make an effort to play in an organized, structured milsim environment.

Call that elitist? Go ahead. Paintballers had called us elitists for years, we never lost a wink of sleep over it.

And to the new players who actually are serious? Don't worry, you'll find us, just like we always found each other in the past.

True airsoft and milsim isn't dead, we're just off the radar again. And to those who've just now realized what's going on, now's a good time to get to the lifeboats.

The bottom line is simple, really: anyone's free to play how they like, with the equipment they like. But that doesn't mean others are obliged to play with you.

[pusangani]

Ginnz - you are NOT part of the community, your opinion is neither wanted nor cared for, people like you who want airsoft for stupid purposes like shooting cats is the reason we tried to restrict access to guns

whoever AV'd you should have their age verifier status reviewed And your age verified status removed as you contribute nothing to this "childish wannabe army man community"

HGI - BM is a solid member of the Ontario community and has done alot more for this sport than you ever will so back the eff off

[arman]

...this thread went downhill fast...

[Mudder]

Originally Posted by Drake

The bottom line is simple, really: anyone's free to play how they like, with the equipment they like. But that doesn't mean others are obliged to play with you.

A O K

[ginnz]

Originally Posted by Daiviet

So you're saying the typical airsofter is either someone who is still in the forces, or has the mindset of a twelve year old. Once again I must reiterate: Get out of my hobby[/SIZE]

sorry Daiviet, you must have misunderstood, i wasnt referring to the average airsofter in general, i was actually referring to you in general..... sorry for any confusion in this matter....

alpha tango foxtrot whiskey in the jaro out....

[Neil_N]

The ideas of the vets are not really that unrealistic. Correct me if I’m wrong but in the UK don’t they have airsoft licenses. I remember something along the lines that to acquire one of these licenses you must participate at a certain number of games a year. this isn’t that harsh of a stance then the new comers must make it through a few games without finding they just like real looking guns or have the community ask them to never come back, Correct me if I’m wrong on this.
The fact of the matter is the cheap guns is not the problem it’s the attitude that comes with them. Those of you complaining about the elitists just need to find a different sport. It’s their Community that they founded; let them do as they please with it. We are only guests until we can show our maturity and eventually become part of it. BTW I’m a newb I'm using a shitsoft G&G but at least I understand and accept my place in the community.

[Jimski]

I don't know for elsewhere, but here in MTL all the new players that have joined since 2004 are very good and motivated players.
The Canadian-legal guns that IG and others are bringing in make everyone happy, and to be honest I haven't seen many wannabe gangstas in jeans running around with clearsoft.

[ujiro]

Wow... This is ridiculous.

Brian, swatt13, Daiviet: right on brothers. Good work. I whole heartedly agree with everything you guys are putting out there, 100%.

HGI, Ginnz, Mudder: Dear lord. I don't even know what to say to you guys.

Ginnz, good job, you can personally attack someone you don't even known (Daiviet) who is an established member of this community. FAIL. You prove our point by showing that, well, the vets may be a bit elitest, but they know they are and accept it, whereas the new guys are just childish and immature.

[ginnz]

whatever, i believe i was "attacked" first..... but im letting it all go, all i had was a point to make regarding the OP..... and i guess i partially misinterpreted the point, and had cleared that up with the other guy.... its just a little ridiculous how some guys get so bent out of shape when discussing their plastic shooting BB guns.

ill clear out of this thread, all im interested in is collecting the guns, and really like to work on them in my spare time..... thats all.

and i now see the point of the OP's post, as pointed out to me by TheSaint, as a group of guys get together for "gaming" all taking their hobby seriously, investing substantial coin in their guns/gear, trying to keep it as realistic as possible, and some guys come into the game wearing jeans and waving around clearsoft hi cap guns.... i can see why they would feel dissed by this....

but my original post was to emphasize the attitudes that contribute to the "death of a hobby", not to put anyone down, and i apologize if thats what ive done, no disrespect intended.....i guess i shot back a little to quickly, but to have a guy jump on me and tell me to "leave his hobby" over making a simple case in point, was pretty much exactly the attitude i was getting at in my post to begin with..... so it is what it is....

but ill say it again, if i insulted anyone here, i apologize.

[Daiviet]

Originally Posted by Mudder

Quaking in my boots, junior!
Note I said, They and They're, get with the syntax.

:lol:

My quote was posted 2 hours before you could edit your post and add information. Originally you agreed with the personal attack on Brian M. I'm with the syntax in which you meant in the beginning. Childish remarks will get you no where.

Originally Posted by ginnz

sorry Daiviet, you must have misunderstood, i wasnt referring to the average airsofter in general, i was actually referring to you in general..... sorry for any confusion in this matter....

alpha tango foxtrot whiskey in the jaro out....

You cannot label me as a 12 year old army wannabe without labelling others as well. I do this hobby because it's something I enjoy, not because I'm training for the forces. I'm sure there are a lot of others here who enjoy this hobby for the same reasons I do, and thus painting them with that same description of a 12 year old wannabe.

Originally Posted by Torque

Why not just avoid games or host or clubs that don't meet your minimum load out requirment. This seems more of the host and club owners responsablity. Just my 2cents.

Agreed, but to a point. Avoiding games that don't appeal to you is definetly the easiest solution. The issue is that for some members, their local games don't hold up the same minimum loadouts or allow random walk ons from the general public to play. Those members don't have to much of a choice if other fields are too far away, or if the airsoft community in their area is based on a very limited amount of people. If the player really enjoys the hobby and wants to play, but their field allows these untrained newbies to join up, what choice does the person really have in which games they want to attend.

Originally Posted by Jimski

I don't know for elsewhere, but here in MTL all the new players that have joined since 2004 are very good and motivated players.
The Canadian-legal guns that IG and others are bringing in make everyone happy, and to be honest I haven't seen many wannabe gangstas in jeans running around with clearsoft.

Thats very good, sounds like Montreal has a very close airsoft community. I'd love to join you guys for a game up there one day.

There haven't been too many wanna gangstas that i've seen, but I have noticed at games new people who just randomly pick up a broxa or kraken or dmps panther, show up to a game in a t shirt and jeans, and expect to play. To no fault, I understand why vets turn them away, or tell them that if they're truely interested, to observe and learn, to see if they're really interested in the game.

People can say we're elitest towards paintball. Good, I don't care, we probably are. I'd prefer the elitest and exclusive nature of airsoft over the doorless, unguarded gates of the paintball world any day.

[safx]

Geez, this declined into a slinging
poop-fest over night...

Brian may have his views on why
things have declined, but that doesn't
take anything away from what he
does every week at his facility.
Judge him by his actions.

Take last night as an example—
about 10 people attended his CQB
2 man training night, most were
new players/inexperienced ones.
There was some clear-soft and
lots of civilian clothes. Before we
started everyone was shown what
was expected and effective in the
environment. Of course it was
reiteration for me But never
hurts to keep seeing demos on
safety, proper gun handling,
effective team movement, silent
commands etc etc.

There were 3 of us who've been
playing there for a lot longer than
the new comers, but we treated
the new guys just how we like to
be treated. Of course not every
game/drill went perfect but we
offered correction and advice when
ever possible. Trigger control was
a little loose on the dead coming
out of play, but they'll learn just
as we did from the guys before us.
I think we demonstrated that we
weren't trying to rack up kills but
to have quality games and would
not take risky shots to do so. And
hopefully that kind of play has
been passed on.

The new guys all seemed to have
a great time. After the night, as
usual anyone who wanted to hang
out and chit chat was welcome in
the lounge. All nice guys looking
forward to seeing them again, but
for the love of airsoft-god— get a
full-face mask and gloves!

PS: that toy I was showing off was
a Maruzen MP5k GBB. Fun eh?

[Torque]

I have a quick question. Are you guys mad at people that show up to their first game in jeans and have a clearsoft or ones that play for more then a few months like that. How long does one have between their first game and requireing all the goods needed?